Clarifying the meaning of seclusion with a non-mahram woman and its forms

The questioner:
The question of Shaykh Abu Bakr: When is seclusion with a non-mahram woman forbidden? He said: The following forms occur in their time or in their context. The first form is a man with his wife.

The Shaykh:
This is seclusion. Seclusion with a non-mahram woman means being in a place where no one else is present, such as a house, the wilderness, a car, or elsewhere. This is seclusion: being in a place with a woman who is not lawful for him, with no one else present. This is the cause of falling into immorality, and it empowers Satan over them. This is the forbidden seclusion. Yes.

The questioner:
And other than Paradise, it is eternal, by Allah.

The Shaykh:
What do you think?

The questioner:
Its form, O father. I said with your wife. Allahu Akbar. I said what is its need?

The Shaykh:
No, it is not seclusion if there is a second woman or more, or men, then it becomes seclusion. Seclusion is when he and she are in an empty place, with no one else with them. Being with a doctor in his room, being with a manager in his office, being with a driver in his car who is not one of her mahrams, this is seclusion in a house where only he and the woman are present; this is the forbidden seclusion. But if there are more than two in the house, with a third person or more, whether male or female, the seclusion is removed in that case. Yes.

The questioner:
The second form: I hope to illuminate a household’s needs in a car.

The Shaykh:
Yes.

The questioner:
Long, we are going with a person from the mahrams in the car.

The Shaykh:
This is like the first; the seclusion increases. If there is a place with them, the seclusion increases, whether in the car or in any place.