Discussion with Nasser al-'Umar and the Shaykh's request for him to clear himself of the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood, and the Shaykh's discussion with him regarding Salman al-'Udah and 'Abd al-Rahman 'Abd al-Khalq.
Machine translationRead the Arabic original
The questioner : I do not agree with it.
The Shaykh : And peace be upon you, and Allah's mercy and blessings. May Allah reward you with good.
The questioner : That we read from its introduction and its indexes!
The Shaykh : No, this requires reading calmly.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : But now we want to benefit from you with something other than what is recorded in the book, let alone what is recorded on the tapes. We want, for example, news about the people of Makkah?
The questioner : Yes, Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : I say this regarding the first point, the jurisprudence of reality.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : Because it is suspected that it is a fundamental issue raised in the topic, yes, as a fundamental issue.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : And therefore, as you heard and as was conveyed to me byThe Shaykh : Waleed and by others, no, and I seek Allah's forgiveness that I am also in the position of objecting or saying that what I mentioned is what I intended!
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : What I mentioned is what I intended. If, praise be to Allah, I was able to express that, then praise be to Allah. If there is an error in the expression or in the writing, then correct it according to what I mentioned!
The Shaykh : Like this.
The questioner : Yes, this is what I say regarding this issue.
The Shaykh : What Allah willed.
The questioner : As I clarified in the issue of the jurisprudence of reality, as I said a moment ago, and as was conveyed byThe Shaykh : Waleed and others.
The Shaykh : All right, may Allah reward you with good.
The questioner : So, since the book is available, read it as you see in the form that preceded
The Shaykh : If Allah wills, we will read it and benefit greatly from you, if Allah wills.
The questioner : Apart from the jurisprudence of reality, I feel that the raising of the issues is strange. For example, the issue that these are brothers from the Muslim Brotherhood. I do not want to enter into the topic of the Muslim Brotherhood and what is in their favor and what is against them in this speech. We benefit from them with such principles, but I say that this accusation is based on things that are false from their origin!
The Shaykh : Yes, can we understand some of these falsehoods?
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Go ahead.
The questioner : I say the accusation that these are brothers, as long as they are brothers, means they represent the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The Shaykh : This is the falsehood upon which falsehoods were built.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : What are they?
The questioner : That they represent the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood, so when the Muslim Brotherhood is discussed!
The Shaykh : This is the first falsehood. May Allah reward you.
The questioner : Yes, this is the falsehood, O Shaykh. This first falsehood was built upon, and issues concerning the Muslim Brotherhood were taken and we were made to wear them, and this is not correct!
The Shaykh: All right.
The questioner : The other: ... O Shaykh.
The Shaykh : No, is there? Have you clarified your position regarding the Muslim Brotherhood?
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : On a tape, for example.
The questioner : In books.
The Shaykh : In your books.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh: Good.
The questioner : I clarified it on a tape and here, without the issue of praising partisanship, I spoke about it!
The Shaykh: Good.
The Shaykh : The issue of the concessions that I presented earlier, and also my explanations and my lessons and my methodology, the methodology of the people of the Sunnah, negates these implications. As for saying that you give a lecture to the Muslim Brotherhood, I did not do so, and I do not see that my not speaking about the Muslim Brotherhood obligates me to be one of them if I do not speak about them. This is not obligatory!
The Shaykh : Excuse me, I did not understand. I hope the brothers will be with us to help us understand. My question was perhaps deficient. Did you not clarify your position regarding the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood in a lecture?
The questioner : By explicitly naming the Muslim Brotherhood.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : By the name of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner: No.
The Shaykh : Why? As long as you are accused of being one of them!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And as long as, praise be to Allah, you say that this accusation is false
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Why do you not explicitly clear yourself of being one of them!
The questioner : I did not enter into the topic of discussion. I took the position, O Shaykh, of not entering into the discussion of all these issues. If I entered into them, I would enter into their details. I still say that the disagreement is based on incorrect things, and I see that the root of the disagreement is from a mistake in understanding. So I do not see the approach of returning again and saying, "I was accused of such and such, and my position is such and such." I do not see this approach. And therefore I told you, O Shaykh, and I did not speak a word, and asThe Shaykh : 'Ali mentioned a moment ago, when it came to the statement ofThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz, I have a viewpoint in this issue. So when it is necessary that we stand with the statement ofThe Shaykh : what is happening among the students of knowledge, regardless of who is intended, and everyone knows himself in this issue, I say I did not enter, and I do not see entering into this issue for many reasons!
The questioner : The other: Our brother mentioned a word I still remember. He says: those who interpret the speech ofThe Shaykh : al-Mard, such and such, and the intended meaning is such and such... And this was actually a word of impulse, because some of our brothers interpreted the tape of the statement, each according to his own viewpoint, and they became, unfortunately, declarations. So our brotherThe Shaykh : Nasser's speech was truly, meaning, dots on the letters, very good!
The Shaykh : Yes, but just a clarification, since we are discussing the issue
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : That the statement ofThe Shaykh : WhenThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz spoke, he clarified to us those who were identified, or some of those who were identified. They understood this through a gathering of a number of Shaykhs. So it did not come from them as mere thinking or an idea or an interpretation of whatThe Shaykh : was said, but I saw that not entering into the topic at all is necessary. This point must be clarified, otherwise, as for those who spoke, they say this is what he intendedThe Shaykh : and we are in a gathering with so-and-so and so-and-so, and he clarified to usThe Shaykh : they are proceeding from this issue. My principle, which I committed to, is that I do not speak about this topic at all.
The Shaykh : Okay, can we know the reason?
The questioner : Yes, the reason, the reason goes back to several reasons. First, I am convinced that there is a third category, if the expression is correct, so this matter does not require this discussion. Let the discussion be between the students of knowledge and between the people of the same methodology!
The Shaykh : And peace be upon you, and Allah's mercy and blessings. My teacher, I am not speaking about the discussion!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : I am speaking about a word that clarifies that you are not from the Muslim Brotherhood first!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And second, that your methodology differs from the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. The matter does not require a discussion, just a word of truth that you say to clear yourself from what you were falsely accused of!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : That you are from the Muslim Brotherhood, this is first.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And second, that your methodology is not the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : I say, for example, in general, our school, our methodology, differs from the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. One word: our methodology is jurisprudence, then masses, and the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood is masses, then culture, then do not water it. You say this is what I say. As long as you are accused of being from the Muslim Brotherhood because of this article or others, what does the issue require? A discussion? Clarifying this is a clarification for the people. I was falsely accused of being from the Muslim Brotherhood. I am first not from the Muslim Brotherhood. Second, my methodology is Salafi, differing from the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. My methodology is culture, clarifying to the people what we were commanded with in the Book and the Sunnah and the methodology of the righteous predecessors. The Muslim Brotherhood is masses, gathering for the sake of votes, for the sake of elections, for the sake of entering parliament, and so on. And this is not your methodology. And Allah is sufficient for the believers in fighting. The matter does not require a discussion, and perhaps in the future we will benefit from you, if Allah wills.
Regarding the scholars, what is circulated about some of them is that they do not acknowledge the virtue of the scholars and their efforts, and may even disparage their status?
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Of course, you heard this.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Like what we heard, and perhaps more than that. So as for what is heard, does it have validity with you?
The questioner : This is a message!
The Shaykh : Yes, there are no people who disparage the status of the scholars.
The questioner : That there are no people, I do not think so, but the ones concerned!
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : I do not know this about them.
The Shaykh : The ones concerned.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Okay, these concerned ones, are their names explicitly mentioned or is it by hinting and insinuating?
The questioner : By Allah, it is almost explicit, O Shaykh, and he explicitly mentioned their names. Yes.
The Shaykh : Yes?
The questioner : There are those who explicitly mentioned their names?
The Shaykh : Okay, can we know who explicitly mentioned and who almost explicitly mentioned by name? Is that possible?
The questioner: Yes.
The questioner : The other: ...
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you. Double object.
The questioner : The one who explicitly mentioned and the one who spoke and the one who was spoken about. But I do not mean, if truly someone mocked the scholars, I say there are those who mocked the scholars!
The Shaykh : We understood this.
The Shaykh : Yes, we understood this.
The questioner : As for the individuals who are accused of mocking the scholars or diminishing the scholars, from what I know, mention ofThe Shaykh : Safar may come, and mention ofThe Shaykh : Salman may come.
The Shaykh : Here, may Allah reward you, the ones who are disparaged.
The questioner : These are the scholars who are disparaged.
The Shaykh : You mean that this is disparaged in them.
The questioner : These, yes, these are the ones who are accused.
The Shaykh : Who are the disparagers?
The questioner : They are accused of being the ones who make veiled criticisms.
The Shaykh : They are accused of being the ones who make veiled criticisms.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Okay, and who are the ones being criticized?
The questioner : No specific names were mentioned; the scholars did not specify, just yes.
The Shaykh : Okay, is this accusation completely baseless?
The questioner : As far as I know, their relationship with their scholars has absolutely no basis!
The Shaykh : Praise be to Allah.
The questioner : But you sometimes find phrases, O our Shaykh, that are taken out of context!
The Shaykh : Yes, this is a broad subject!
The questioner : It is a broad subject. From this perspective, I was traveling outside the Kingdom, which is better, and a hadith came up, but I did not mention specific names. I said there are some whom you find in knowledge like this, but you do not find in them... and there are some who surround our scholars, and I did not want, and they were not on my mind, until I said... in some countries, especially in Tunisia, when someone comes from Tunisia and Algeria, I saw there some who claim to be scholars, but I saw the most amazing things from them!
The Shaykh : No, what concerns us is in your country.
The questioner : I say the phrase that these people make veiled criticisms of the scholars; on the contrary, they sometimes say, meaning that endorsements came for all these people fromThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz ibn Baz, endorsements for Shaykh Salman and for Shaykh Safer and for Shaykh 'A'id and for others, very strong endorsements for them and for the most prominent shaykhs.
The questioner : The other: ...
The questioner : Very strong, and praise be to Allah.
The Shaykh : Praise be to Allah.
The questioner : We have a monthly meeting withThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz
The Shaykh : Very good.
The questioner : Thabit, and upon the one who claims to prove this matter
The Shaykh: OkayThe Shaykh : Salman, whom I mentioned earlier.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Does he not make veiled criticisms of groups in the book *Al-Ghuraba'* or... or so on, in what I have read and known?
The questioner : By Allah, I do not know, meaning I discussed it with him and asked him, but I have not read this book?
The Shaykh : I have not read... .
The questioner : ... apart from the scholars, I know he has respect for the general body of recognized scholars, and if I wanted to name them, I would, because he named them to me!
The Shaykh : ... we did not understand this.
The questioner : I do not know of any veiled criticism by him of these scholars, meaning for example he once mentioned that a preacher stood up and read a written sermon during the Mamluk era or otherwise!
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : He said this is not a scholar... .
The Shaykh : You have not read anything of his books.
The questioner: No.
The Shaykh : All of them, okay, I hope you will benefit us with the question directed to the professor earlier: is there not speech that does not mean a specific person, but rather means a group or a faction or so on, so who does it mean?
The questioner : By Allah, it may be that I speak.
The questioner : The other: ... there is harshness in their nature, and before this there is not... !
The Shaykh : Come on, in the name of Allah, may Allah bless you.
The questioner : The other: But first... of your time.
The Shaykh : No, this is not first and not last... okay, may Allah reward you with good, this is not with you, this is a correct explanation with others.
The questioner : Yes, but it is considered with us.
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you with good in any case, your viewpoint and my viewpoint
The questioner : Ibn al-Jawzi (may Allah have mercy on him).
The Shaykh : Ibn al-Jawzi.
The questioner : ...
The Shaykh : I seek refuge in Allah, may Allah protect you.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : This is the first point.
The questioner : As for second, the connections, as for my connections and the connections ofThe Shaykh : Therefore we reserved for tomorrow in the evening.
The Shaykh : If Allah wills, they say there is a prisoner there.
The questioner : Free the prisoners
The Shaykh : Hehe, if you are told to leave... do you leave or not now?
The questioner : And therefore we say...
The Shaykh : Well done, may Allah reward you with good, if I search with you later
The questioner : O Shaykh, also, and we have commitments regarding appointments; as for me, I have appointments in Makkah, I have appointments with a delegation that will come from Riyadh to Makkah of students of knowledge.
The Shaykh : Meaning there is no room.
The questioner : This is difficult.
The questioner : The other: ... fromThe Shaykh : Very busy, and second, one of our brothers is in prison... and they promised to release him these days and they have not released him, so efforts converged that if this prisoner does not come out this week, the scholars will go as a delegation, meaning it is necessary.
The Shaykh : You should sit with us for days, first increase our gatherings and our visits in sitting with you, then we must alert you and teach you some jurisprudence, do not go out on some lands and countries... .
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh: How.
The questioner : I say, and truly regarding myself, and I see it this way, as for the tree and the stone.. .
The Shaykh : When did you see it here.
The questioner : From the year 95, I came more than once.
The Shaykh : 95 .
The questioner : Yes... my Hijri year.
The Shaykh : This is recorded against you.
The questioner : Yes, my Shaykh.
The Shaykh : And you know us from before.
The questioner : Do not be one of them, O Shaykh, in the year 96.
The Shaykh : Okay, if you were in Syria... .
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh : In brief, can you not extend to us in generosity
The questioner : May Allah reward you, I told you, O Shaykh, as you see, but I am bound by appointments and our effort
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you with good, O Allah, amen.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : We are as you say, but I believe it is also our duty to meet with people like you; we consider this obligatory.
The questioner : May Allah reward you.
The Shaykh : The important thing is if you do not have room to extend to us with days, otherwise what are you doing here!
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh : This sun is here, so in any case now until sunset, it does not matter to you, Allah is the Helper, and there is no power and no strength except by Allah, hopefully that will be soon.
The questioner : ... O Shaykh, we go to him now... the Hajj.
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you with good, you have done us a favor, may Allah reward you with good, so we return to what our brother mentioned; in fact, I read something of this speech!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And I admit that I am very forgetful, so I do not memorize, meaning words like these, but their effect remains in my heart. So when someone like our brother Abu 'Abdullah comes and says I read such and such, I believe him because I find the echo of his speech established in his heart. So when I read such speech, I felt that those who accuse the man of what you have heard from me, and it is that he is a Sufi, meaning he is my brother, I offer him an excuse, because those who label them with what I heard earlier, from one side, and knowing these people who are veiledly criticized in their channel from another side, except that he understands that this author means these people. And I would also like, if it were possible, to meet with this brother Sulayman and discuss some of his words in light of what you suggested earlier, may Allah reward you with good, because I know from my life the truth of the saying of the one who said long ago: "The only defect in news is its narrators."
The questioner : May Allah reward you.
The Shaykh : Yes, and therefore I was very pleased with you, first for your honoring us and coming to our home.
The questioner : I seek forgiveness from Allah, and if it were the other way around, it would have been better for me, but not everything a person wishes for comes to pass.
The questioner : Do not deprive us of the reward, O Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : And do not deprive us of the reward.
The Shaykh : May Allah bless you, excuse me, the other one happened, if Allah wills, I was pleased first with your arrival, second with your raising this book and looking into it.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : This is joy upon joy and delight upon delight!
The questioner : May Allah bless you.
The Shaykh : May Allah preserve you, and reading the book now is not easy, but as we said earlier, the people of Makkah know its valleys best; perhaps you will reach the place of the speech that was, as it is said, or as you hinted at, something that you corrected. Can you show us a phrase to clarify the topic!
The questioner : Yes, he did not hint at the speech that it was said when I speak, it was understood from some of my speech that there was mockery of the scholars!
The Shaykh : I am not concerned with this; I am concerned with what you said about the jurisprudence of reality, what is its value in the Shari'ah.
The questioner : May Allah reward you.
The Shaykh : That is it.
The questioner : So I say I wrote an introduction about the scholars' appreciation, so I quoted a statement from His EminenceThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz ibn Baz.
The Shaykh : I read the second line where you acknowledge the virtue of the scholars.
The questioner : Then you quoted a statement from the Shaykh... .
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : Yes, and this is a point I singled out, very necessary... .
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : I said that one should be aware of these facts first, and the speech is connected to us also.
The Shaykh : Very good.
The questioner : First, that the flesh of scholars is poisoned.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : And Allah's sunnah regarding those who belittle them is known, and upon those who track down stumbles and search for faults, let them fear Allah, and especially regarding the scholars of the Ummah and the leaders of the generations. And I remind them of what the distinguished scholar, His Eminence our honorable Shaykh 'Abd al-'Aziz ibn 'Abd Allah ibn 'Abd Allah ibn Baz, said in response to the claim that scholars do not understand reality, where he said: "It is obligatory for the Muslim to guard his tongue from what is not appropriate and not to speak except with insight." So the statement that so-and-so did not understand reality requires knowledge, and it is not said by anyone except one who has knowledge, so that he can judge that so-and-so did not understand reality. As for saying this casually and judging by his opinion without evidence, this is a great abomination that is not permissible, and knowing that the one who issues a fatwa needs evidence, and that is not possible except for the scholars!
The Shaykh : Okay, but this speech, may Allah bless you, has a veiled criticism in it!
The questioner : And it is!
The Shaykh : There are people in it who speak this kind of talk!
The questioner : Yes, there is.
The Shaykh : Fine, among them.
The questioner : There are young men.
The Shaykh : The young men must have drawn this talk from, I mean, a head or
The questioner : Yes, they may draw it from groups you know... you know them. The existence of this matter does not help, O Shaykh.
The Shaykh : We do not know people who use the term "fiqh al-waqi' (jurisprudence of reality)" in all our lives except in this recent period, and consequently, a fortiori, we do not know people who accuse your scholars of ignorance of fiqh al-waqi'. We do not know this at all. And so, I have no objection; I believe what you said, but I clarify that what you are saying does not apply to students of the schools. They do not know the word "fiqh" in Islam, let alone know fiqh al-waqi'!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : This is a modern, invented expression. It may be a good innovation, as you mentioned earlier from some of our brothers. The blessing of innovation, what is the connection...
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh : Yes, and it may be a bad one. The important thing is the talk now.The Shaykh : Here he hints that there are people who accuse some of the Shaykhs!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : of ignorance of reality, and that this is not permissible to say. If there are now people who say this talk, fine, who are these people? If they are students of schools, then these people are not spoken of... students of schools do not pray, do not fast, perhaps, and they commit sins. They are not paid attention to, and there is no weight to their action or their speech... It must be that they have some sway and movement with some individuals such that they trust them and receive from them this slander or these accusations. So they get heated up; they are young men, and they say, "So-and-so the scholar, yes, this is a scholar, but he has no knowledge of fiqh al-waqi'. And if he has no knowledge of fiqh al-waqi', then his fiqh based on the Book and the Sunnah has no value," and so on. May Allah bless you; you must be more knowledgeable about them than we are, the distant ones who ask, "Who are they?" By Allah, we do not know. So the eyes turn to, for example, our brother Sulayman, who hints at, not a person, but persons, and not unknown persons, but by a methodology. I think it reached me; I did not look into it myself. Our brother Dr. Rabie has a writing in this field. He has a book in this field. Did you read it?
The questioner : This last one, did it not come out?
The Shaykh : It did not come out, but nothing has come out.
The questioner : I know a book of hisThe Shaykh : requesting its stoppingThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz and mentioned, and we were present in the council, he said, "I will askThe Shaykh : Rabie to stop this book!"
The questioner : Fine, my intention is, is there nothing in the field published under his name, by his pen?
The questioner : The Shaykh : Rabie.
The Shaykh : Printed, yes.
The questioner : Printed recently, we do not know.
The Shaykh : There is nothing.
The questioner : On these topics, we do not know.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : But.
The questioner : The other: Forgive me, my Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : The other: This talk, O Shaykh, regarding the ignorance of scholars of the knowledge of reality or fiqh al-waqi' is not new. I remember it when I was in the first year of secondary school, meaning this talk was before the year 1402, ten years ago, when Allah granted me guidance and I straightened out. We were with a young man whose concern was that they did not know the seeking of religious knowledge. In the first period of my life, and it was a duration of three years with them... at the mosque, and these were not Tabligh. They raised [people] on nasheeds and acting and the like. So every time we wanted to say we have problems, we... I remember it now, it circles in my ear until this time. We would say, "Fine, we have issues we want to present toThe Shaykh : Ibn Uthaymeen and toThe Shaykh : Ibn Baz, and the answer would come to us!
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : From these people who do not understand... they have no knowledge... by their names... but they influence the youth. The youth fear this fitnah. The days passed, and Allah the Exalted and Majestic granted... so the days passed... so we went to advise them. An issue came to one of them in Ramadan 1410, and he came to me after the tarawih prayer. "And upon you be peace."
The Shaykh : "And upon you be peace and the mercy of Allah and His blessings. Welcome."
The questioner : "The last ten days, eighteen, seventeen." So he spoke to me. I said, "Where are you going, so-and-so?" He said, "I have rehearsals for acting in the theater." I said to him, "In Ramadan?" I said to him, "Fear Allah for yourself," and I warned him with Allah and mentioned... and the neighbor's dispute, and I said, "In any case, I went to a Shaykh who issues a fatwa permitting acting. Ibn Uthaymeen issues a fatwa permitting acting."
The Shaykh : Did you say it, or did he say it to him?
The questioner : I said to him, "Ask him, and he is the one who sees the permissibility of acting?"
The Shaykh : Very good.
The questioner : In this immersion, I assert that he does not support it?
The Shaykh : Although he says.
The questioner : Although he says it is permissible, he also... he said to me in the exact same words: "Ibn Uthaymeen does not know reality." This was before what is called fiqh al-waqi' came out. Then young men from Afghanistan came to us. Then they began to slander our Shaykhs... some of them climb to the third floor of the Sacred Mosque and declare Ibn Baz and Ibn Uthaymeen disbelievers in the middle of the Sacred Mosque!
The Shaykh : Who is he?
The questioner : They declare Ibn Baz and Ibn Uthaymeen disbelievers.
The Shaykh: I mean.
The questioner : They say that they are disbelievers.
The Shaykh : ... I mean the people who say.
The questioner : Those who came from Afghanistan.
The Shaykh : Ah, those who came from Afghanistan.
The questioner : Yes, on the pretext that they are agents of the sultan and that they are agents of the ruler and that they do not understand reality and do not know the reality in which the ummah lives!
The Shaykh : Peace and the mercy of Allah and His blessings. Yes.
The questioner : This fitnah, I mean, we speak by the grace of Allah, no one can appoint himself to confront it or to show that he slanders the scholars. He cannot do that, but it exists. Its cause is old matters and considerations, but there remain young men in the councils. A messageThe Shaykh : I am here, and confirming the awakening is good.
The Shaykh: Ah, okay.
The questioner : The Shaykh : It does not address students of knowledge. I am not defendingThe Shaykh The Shaykh : There is one who defends himself!
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : I mean, it does not address great, prominent students of knowledge. It says, "You, these young men, are falling into pitfalls... Fear Allah for yourselves. You are taking from us, O Nasser al-'Umar, unfortunately, and O Salman al-'Udah, and O Safer al-Hawali, and O 'A'ish al-Qarni, more than you take from Al-Albani and more than you take from Ibn Baz. And we return to you, saying to you, 'Fear Allah, do not slander the scholars... these scholars.' These are the leaders of the masters. And I do not like to speak in your face because Abu Badr... I mean, his direction is to the youth and his saying, 'Stick to the scholars.' And if you wish to read, if time permits you to read in "The Necessity of Knowledge as a Legal Requirement," and you will also find encouragement of the youth to continue in knowledge!
The Shaykh : May Allah reward him with good.
The questioner : And I do not say it in his face.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : But it happens from what I warned about.The Shaykh : Nasser, and I said to him in the exact same words, and this talk... from the self to him... because he falls into matters that make people interpret them contrary to what he intends. Fine!
The Shaykh : Good.
The questioner : Contrary to what he intends. We know the sincerity of his intention, but we catch him by his finger with what his hand has earned. So fine, he is...The Shaykh : Salman, his lectures are not written at all; they are transcribed tapes, andThe Shaykh : Salman is not likeThe Shaykh : Nasser... and I know this thing.The Shaykh : Salman... more thanThe Shaykh : Nasser... so he reviews it round after round, looking at his engagements and the many visitors to him here. He says, for example, and you find a third category. I read to you from what I meant by "scientific Islam." They learn the Sunnah and hadith, and they work on distinguishing the authentic from the defective... in narrating weak and fabricated hadiths, and this may be accompanied by roughness or weakness in worship or heedlessness of the reality of the ummah.
The Shaykh : A mistake.
The questioner : It is accompanied by some roughness.
The Shaykh : A typographical or verbal error.
The questioner : No, verbal, from the roughness or weakness in worship or heedlessness of the reality of the ummah.
The Shaykh : This book is for Salman.
The questioner : Salman al-Oudah.
The Shaykh : Ah, Salman.
The questioner : I say to the ShaykhThe Shaykh : Salman. We know him, but we cannot defend him because he is being sued for what his hand has written. Fine.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : So how, and he himself wrote this thing now...
The Shaykh : Fine, did you not review it?
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : You did not review it.
The questioner : NowThe Shaykh : He says, "Review it after me," meaning...
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : The other: If you permit me, O Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : The other:The Shaykh : Salman. I point to two points.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : The other: The issue that they say he is a Saruri and a Muslim Brotherhood member!
The Shaykh : And upon you be peace and the mercy and blessings of Allah.
The questioner : The other: I knowThe Shaykh : Salman is not a Muslim Brotherhood member, and I almost swear to it. I knowThe Shaykh : Salman!
The Shaykh : He is not a Muslim Brotherhood member and not a Saruri!
The questioner : The other: Yes, I swear to it.
The Shaykh : But there is a reality.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : This is what we hope to gain from you, either negatively, as I hope, or positively, if we are to be sorry. It may not be brotherly, but his methodology is brotherly. First, do you distinguish between the two with me? That is, it is not brotherly, but his methodology is brotherly!
The questioner : The other: I mean, does this apply to a specific person?
The Shaykh : Allow me.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Do you distinguish between the two with me?
The questioner : The other: Yes, I distinguish.
The Shaykh: All right.
The questioner : The other: Yes.
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you, if you swore that he is not brotherly and is not, and you are not obligated to swear, and there is no need for that!
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : But the important matter is that he not be brotherly.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : The important matter is that his methodology not be brotherly. So here, the question is: do you not feel that his methodology is brotherly?
The questioner : The other: By Allah, absolutely not.
The questioner : I do not see it.
The Shaykh : Uttering this corrupts...
The questioner : There may be, O Shaykh, issues, yes, there may be.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : From which it is understood that he follows.
The Shaykh : That he.
The questioner : He follows such speech as you said.
The Shaykh: All right.
The questioner : But isThe Shaykh : his methodology brotherly? This is your statement, O Shaykh, and it is very important, because the issue is one of methodology, not names!
The Shaykh : That is it!
The questioner : Names change, but methodologies remain.
The Shaykh : Therefore, may Allah reward you.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : You should not be too enthusiastic in saying that I swear he is not brotherly; nothing is gained from that!
The questioner : And even his methodology.
The Shaykh : The important thing is that his methodology not be the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. So I am giving you an example now!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Clarifying my question, and thereby you clarify to me the reality you perceive from our brother Sulayman!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Or Salman. I am giving you an example now from our Salafi brothers. I am like you in that I am certain he is not brotherly, but his methodology is brotherly, and he is a Salafi. I do not think you know him well, and he is 'Abd al-Rahman 'Abd al-Khalq!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Do you know him?
The questioner : I know him.
The Shaykh : Good, he is my student at the Islamic University!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And when he was, he was brotherly, and if the expression is correct, he became a Salafi there at the university!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And he was among the best of the youth who were aware of the lessons and methodologies, and so on. I say, as you say about Salman, that he is not brotherly, but his methodology is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. How is that? First, it is partisanship and bloc formation. Do you not know this!
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : 'Abd al-Rahman.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Fine, this partisanship and this bloc formation is not on the Salafi methodology that we call to, is it not so!
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Well, then, if Salman, who is being discussed now in this speech and in others, we say about him that he is not brotherly, and we are truthful, but that does not exempt him from having a methodology that is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. Here, the caution is that he is not brotherly, but his methodology is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. So I am asking you now: do you feel from him that he blocs people and blocs the youth and encourages them in the way the Muslim Brotherhood encourages their helpers and companions, and so on? I said in the previous session that the methodology of the Brotherhood is to bloc, then to educate, then nothing. There is nothing in it but blind bloc formation, no education and nothing. As proof, nearly a century has passed for the Muslim Brotherhood in various countries, and they have not moved from the military system, because their methodology suggests this to them. They do not advance, not in knowledge, not in creed, not in behavior, as they are exactly. You cannot find a brother of the Muslim Brotherhood who follows the methodology of the Sunnah, at least outwardly. You find one of them imitating Hassan al-Banna, taking from his beard and making it as some Hanafi jurists say in the books of the Hanafis, as the non-Arabs or the Moroccans do. They are concerned with following Hassan al-Banna, and it is not in their minds to follow the Master of the Prophets (peace and blessings be upon him). So now, is there any of this bloc formation and this gathering of the youth? This happened in Kuwait before the incident happened to them, so 'Abd al-Rahman and those around him became preoccupied with the education of the group and teaching them and raising them with Islamic upbringing because of this partisanship and this bloc formation. And this is one of the effects of secular partisanship. Do you hear now the problem that saddens every Muslim heart? What happened to our brothers in Algeria. Our brothers in Algeria have enthusiasm for the Muslim Brotherhood, but they have absolutely no education. Then they bloced, they gathered millions around them, but most of them do not understand, most of them do not know except the heat of the youth. We want a Muslim state. "And whoever hastens a thing before its time is tried with its deprivation," as you know. So, may Allah reward you, it is not necessary that we purify a person's name by his personhood that he is brotherly, but the important thing is to purify him from having a methodology that is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. The Muslim Brotherhood, you do not find a Salafi among their heads, as I told you about 'Asim, he is a Salafi, about 'Isam, he is a Salafi in his creed, but he does not call. Meanwhile, we know about Salman and all our brothers, may Allah will it, that they call to the Book and the Sunnah and the methodology of the pious predecessors. But if the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood seeps into them in terms of bloc formation and gathering, then it becomes great for the Salafi methodology, and it will become... So I hope now that I understand from you that the answer should match the reality of the man, that even in his methodology, he does not bloc the youth and does not gather them, but rather he educates them and teaches them, as is obligatory upon every caller.
The questioner : What I know aboutThe Shaykh : Salman is that he is not brotherly, and his methodology is not from the methodology of the Brotherhood!
The Shaykh: All right.
The questioner : But his methodology, according to my knowledge, is the methodology of the people of the Sunnah and the community. It is the methodology of the Salaf of this Ummah in his teaching and his knowledge. And what I know, O Shaykh, the last news that reached himThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz, and he gave him permission that he would start and established what is called a competition for memorizing the Sunnah, on the model of the Qur'an, andThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz himself approved, and he has a number of students who are memorizing the two Sahihs, and he has seven lessons per week!
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : Most of them are in hadith and in the Sunnah, most of them, and he does not have a general lesson except one lesson per week, and it is a lesson you see and hear its tapes in it...
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : This, if I sayThe Shaykh : Salman has no affiliation and no methodology from the methodology of the Brotherhood, this is what I know about him!
The Shaykh : But these words do not meet...!
The questioner : Here, O Shaykh, here I say, I said a little while ago, what did I say? You may make mistakes. I say that this is a mistake, and I am certain that if I discussedThe Shaykh : Salman for a different point of view...
The Shaykh : But it seems that it is not only in this sentence that he has a lot of that thing, for what he distinguishes between...
The Shaykh : And peace be upon you, and Allah's mercy and blessings. May Allah reward you with good.
The questioner : That we read from its introduction and its indexes!
The Shaykh : No, this requires reading calmly.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : But now we want to benefit from you with something other than what is recorded in the book, let alone what is recorded on the tapes. We want, for example, news about the people of Makkah?
The questioner : Yes, Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : I say this regarding the first point, the jurisprudence of reality.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : Because it is suspected that it is a fundamental issue raised in the topic, yes, as a fundamental issue.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : And therefore, as you heard and as was conveyed to me byThe Shaykh : Waleed and by others, no, and I seek Allah's forgiveness that I am also in the position of objecting or saying that what I mentioned is what I intended!
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : What I mentioned is what I intended. If, praise be to Allah, I was able to express that, then praise be to Allah. If there is an error in the expression or in the writing, then correct it according to what I mentioned!
The Shaykh : Like this.
The questioner : Yes, this is what I say regarding this issue.
The Shaykh : What Allah willed.
The questioner : As I clarified in the issue of the jurisprudence of reality, as I said a moment ago, and as was conveyed byThe Shaykh : Waleed and others.
The Shaykh : All right, may Allah reward you with good.
The questioner : So, since the book is available, read it as you see in the form that preceded
The Shaykh : If Allah wills, we will read it and benefit greatly from you, if Allah wills.
The questioner : Apart from the jurisprudence of reality, I feel that the raising of the issues is strange. For example, the issue that these are brothers from the Muslim Brotherhood. I do not want to enter into the topic of the Muslim Brotherhood and what is in their favor and what is against them in this speech. We benefit from them with such principles, but I say that this accusation is based on things that are false from their origin!
The Shaykh : Yes, can we understand some of these falsehoods?
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Go ahead.
The questioner : I say the accusation that these are brothers, as long as they are brothers, means they represent the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The Shaykh : This is the falsehood upon which falsehoods were built.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : What are they?
The questioner : That they represent the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood, so when the Muslim Brotherhood is discussed!
The Shaykh : This is the first falsehood. May Allah reward you.
The questioner : Yes, this is the falsehood, O Shaykh. This first falsehood was built upon, and issues concerning the Muslim Brotherhood were taken and we were made to wear them, and this is not correct!
The Shaykh: All right.
The questioner : The other: ... O Shaykh.
The Shaykh : No, is there? Have you clarified your position regarding the Muslim Brotherhood?
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : On a tape, for example.
The questioner : In books.
The Shaykh : In your books.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh: Good.
The questioner : I clarified it on a tape and here, without the issue of praising partisanship, I spoke about it!
The Shaykh: Good.
The Shaykh : The issue of the concessions that I presented earlier, and also my explanations and my lessons and my methodology, the methodology of the people of the Sunnah, negates these implications. As for saying that you give a lecture to the Muslim Brotherhood, I did not do so, and I do not see that my not speaking about the Muslim Brotherhood obligates me to be one of them if I do not speak about them. This is not obligatory!
The Shaykh : Excuse me, I did not understand. I hope the brothers will be with us to help us understand. My question was perhaps deficient. Did you not clarify your position regarding the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood in a lecture?
The questioner : By explicitly naming the Muslim Brotherhood.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : By the name of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner: No.
The Shaykh : Why? As long as you are accused of being one of them!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And as long as, praise be to Allah, you say that this accusation is false
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Why do you not explicitly clear yourself of being one of them!
The questioner : I did not enter into the topic of discussion. I took the position, O Shaykh, of not entering into the discussion of all these issues. If I entered into them, I would enter into their details. I still say that the disagreement is based on incorrect things, and I see that the root of the disagreement is from a mistake in understanding. So I do not see the approach of returning again and saying, "I was accused of such and such, and my position is such and such." I do not see this approach. And therefore I told you, O Shaykh, and I did not speak a word, and asThe Shaykh : 'Ali mentioned a moment ago, when it came to the statement ofThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz, I have a viewpoint in this issue. So when it is necessary that we stand with the statement ofThe Shaykh : what is happening among the students of knowledge, regardless of who is intended, and everyone knows himself in this issue, I say I did not enter, and I do not see entering into this issue for many reasons!
The questioner : The other: Our brother mentioned a word I still remember. He says: those who interpret the speech ofThe Shaykh : al-Mard, such and such, and the intended meaning is such and such... And this was actually a word of impulse, because some of our brothers interpreted the tape of the statement, each according to his own viewpoint, and they became, unfortunately, declarations. So our brotherThe Shaykh : Nasser's speech was truly, meaning, dots on the letters, very good!
The Shaykh : Yes, but just a clarification, since we are discussing the issue
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : That the statement ofThe Shaykh : WhenThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz spoke, he clarified to us those who were identified, or some of those who were identified. They understood this through a gathering of a number of Shaykhs. So it did not come from them as mere thinking or an idea or an interpretation of whatThe Shaykh : was said, but I saw that not entering into the topic at all is necessary. This point must be clarified, otherwise, as for those who spoke, they say this is what he intendedThe Shaykh : and we are in a gathering with so-and-so and so-and-so, and he clarified to usThe Shaykh : they are proceeding from this issue. My principle, which I committed to, is that I do not speak about this topic at all.
The Shaykh : Okay, can we know the reason?
The questioner : Yes, the reason, the reason goes back to several reasons. First, I am convinced that there is a third category, if the expression is correct, so this matter does not require this discussion. Let the discussion be between the students of knowledge and between the people of the same methodology!
The Shaykh : And peace be upon you, and Allah's mercy and blessings. My teacher, I am not speaking about the discussion!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : I am speaking about a word that clarifies that you are not from the Muslim Brotherhood first!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And second, that your methodology differs from the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. The matter does not require a discussion, just a word of truth that you say to clear yourself from what you were falsely accused of!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : That you are from the Muslim Brotherhood, this is first.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And second, that your methodology is not the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : I say, for example, in general, our school, our methodology, differs from the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. One word: our methodology is jurisprudence, then masses, and the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood is masses, then culture, then do not water it. You say this is what I say. As long as you are accused of being from the Muslim Brotherhood because of this article or others, what does the issue require? A discussion? Clarifying this is a clarification for the people. I was falsely accused of being from the Muslim Brotherhood. I am first not from the Muslim Brotherhood. Second, my methodology is Salafi, differing from the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. My methodology is culture, clarifying to the people what we were commanded with in the Book and the Sunnah and the methodology of the righteous predecessors. The Muslim Brotherhood is masses, gathering for the sake of votes, for the sake of elections, for the sake of entering parliament, and so on. And this is not your methodology. And Allah is sufficient for the believers in fighting. The matter does not require a discussion, and perhaps in the future we will benefit from you, if Allah wills.
Regarding the scholars, what is circulated about some of them is that they do not acknowledge the virtue of the scholars and their efforts, and may even disparage their status?
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Of course, you heard this.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Like what we heard, and perhaps more than that. So as for what is heard, does it have validity with you?
The questioner : This is a message!
The Shaykh : Yes, there are no people who disparage the status of the scholars.
The questioner : That there are no people, I do not think so, but the ones concerned!
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : I do not know this about them.
The Shaykh : The ones concerned.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Okay, these concerned ones, are their names explicitly mentioned or is it by hinting and insinuating?
The questioner : By Allah, it is almost explicit, O Shaykh, and he explicitly mentioned their names. Yes.
The Shaykh : Yes?
The questioner : There are those who explicitly mentioned their names?
The Shaykh : Okay, can we know who explicitly mentioned and who almost explicitly mentioned by name? Is that possible?
The questioner: Yes.
The questioner : The other: ...
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you. Double object.
The questioner : The one who explicitly mentioned and the one who spoke and the one who was spoken about. But I do not mean, if truly someone mocked the scholars, I say there are those who mocked the scholars!
The Shaykh : We understood this.
The Shaykh : Yes, we understood this.
The questioner : As for the individuals who are accused of mocking the scholars or diminishing the scholars, from what I know, mention ofThe Shaykh : Safar may come, and mention ofThe Shaykh : Salman may come.
The Shaykh : Here, may Allah reward you, the ones who are disparaged.
The questioner : These are the scholars who are disparaged.
The Shaykh : You mean that this is disparaged in them.
The questioner : These, yes, these are the ones who are accused.
The Shaykh : Who are the disparagers?
The questioner : They are accused of being the ones who make veiled criticisms.
The Shaykh : They are accused of being the ones who make veiled criticisms.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Okay, and who are the ones being criticized?
The questioner : No specific names were mentioned; the scholars did not specify, just yes.
The Shaykh : Okay, is this accusation completely baseless?
The questioner : As far as I know, their relationship with their scholars has absolutely no basis!
The Shaykh : Praise be to Allah.
The questioner : But you sometimes find phrases, O our Shaykh, that are taken out of context!
The Shaykh : Yes, this is a broad subject!
The questioner : It is a broad subject. From this perspective, I was traveling outside the Kingdom, which is better, and a hadith came up, but I did not mention specific names. I said there are some whom you find in knowledge like this, but you do not find in them... and there are some who surround our scholars, and I did not want, and they were not on my mind, until I said... in some countries, especially in Tunisia, when someone comes from Tunisia and Algeria, I saw there some who claim to be scholars, but I saw the most amazing things from them!
The Shaykh : No, what concerns us is in your country.
The questioner : I say the phrase that these people make veiled criticisms of the scholars; on the contrary, they sometimes say, meaning that endorsements came for all these people fromThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz ibn Baz, endorsements for Shaykh Salman and for Shaykh Safer and for Shaykh 'A'id and for others, very strong endorsements for them and for the most prominent shaykhs.
The questioner : The other: ...
The questioner : Very strong, and praise be to Allah.
The Shaykh : Praise be to Allah.
The questioner : We have a monthly meeting withThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz
The Shaykh : Very good.
The questioner : Thabit, and upon the one who claims to prove this matter
The Shaykh: OkayThe Shaykh : Salman, whom I mentioned earlier.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Does he not make veiled criticisms of groups in the book *Al-Ghuraba'* or... or so on, in what I have read and known?
The questioner : By Allah, I do not know, meaning I discussed it with him and asked him, but I have not read this book?
The Shaykh : I have not read... .
The questioner : ... apart from the scholars, I know he has respect for the general body of recognized scholars, and if I wanted to name them, I would, because he named them to me!
The Shaykh : ... we did not understand this.
The questioner : I do not know of any veiled criticism by him of these scholars, meaning for example he once mentioned that a preacher stood up and read a written sermon during the Mamluk era or otherwise!
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : He said this is not a scholar... .
The Shaykh : You have not read anything of his books.
The questioner: No.
The Shaykh : All of them, okay, I hope you will benefit us with the question directed to the professor earlier: is there not speech that does not mean a specific person, but rather means a group or a faction or so on, so who does it mean?
The questioner : By Allah, it may be that I speak.
The questioner : The other: ... there is harshness in their nature, and before this there is not... !
The Shaykh : Come on, in the name of Allah, may Allah bless you.
The questioner : The other: But first... of your time.
The Shaykh : No, this is not first and not last... okay, may Allah reward you with good, this is not with you, this is a correct explanation with others.
The questioner : Yes, but it is considered with us.
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you with good in any case, your viewpoint and my viewpoint
The questioner : Ibn al-Jawzi (may Allah have mercy on him).
The Shaykh : Ibn al-Jawzi.
The questioner : ...
The Shaykh : I seek refuge in Allah, may Allah protect you.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : This is the first point.
The questioner : As for second, the connections, as for my connections and the connections ofThe Shaykh : Therefore we reserved for tomorrow in the evening.
The Shaykh : If Allah wills, they say there is a prisoner there.
The questioner : Free the prisoners
The Shaykh : Hehe, if you are told to leave... do you leave or not now?
The questioner : And therefore we say...
The Shaykh : Well done, may Allah reward you with good, if I search with you later
The questioner : O Shaykh, also, and we have commitments regarding appointments; as for me, I have appointments in Makkah, I have appointments with a delegation that will come from Riyadh to Makkah of students of knowledge.
The Shaykh : Meaning there is no room.
The questioner : This is difficult.
The questioner : The other: ... fromThe Shaykh : Very busy, and second, one of our brothers is in prison... and they promised to release him these days and they have not released him, so efforts converged that if this prisoner does not come out this week, the scholars will go as a delegation, meaning it is necessary.
The Shaykh : You should sit with us for days, first increase our gatherings and our visits in sitting with you, then we must alert you and teach you some jurisprudence, do not go out on some lands and countries... .
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh: How.
The questioner : I say, and truly regarding myself, and I see it this way, as for the tree and the stone.. .
The Shaykh : When did you see it here.
The questioner : From the year 95, I came more than once.
The Shaykh : 95 .
The questioner : Yes... my Hijri year.
The Shaykh : This is recorded against you.
The questioner : Yes, my Shaykh.
The Shaykh : And you know us from before.
The questioner : Do not be one of them, O Shaykh, in the year 96.
The Shaykh : Okay, if you were in Syria... .
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh : In brief, can you not extend to us in generosity
The questioner : May Allah reward you, I told you, O Shaykh, as you see, but I am bound by appointments and our effort
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you with good, O Allah, amen.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : We are as you say, but I believe it is also our duty to meet with people like you; we consider this obligatory.
The questioner : May Allah reward you.
The Shaykh : The important thing is if you do not have room to extend to us with days, otherwise what are you doing here!
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh : This sun is here, so in any case now until sunset, it does not matter to you, Allah is the Helper, and there is no power and no strength except by Allah, hopefully that will be soon.
The questioner : ... O Shaykh, we go to him now... the Hajj.
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you with good, you have done us a favor, may Allah reward you with good, so we return to what our brother mentioned; in fact, I read something of this speech!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And I admit that I am very forgetful, so I do not memorize, meaning words like these, but their effect remains in my heart. So when someone like our brother Abu 'Abdullah comes and says I read such and such, I believe him because I find the echo of his speech established in his heart. So when I read such speech, I felt that those who accuse the man of what you have heard from me, and it is that he is a Sufi, meaning he is my brother, I offer him an excuse, because those who label them with what I heard earlier, from one side, and knowing these people who are veiledly criticized in their channel from another side, except that he understands that this author means these people. And I would also like, if it were possible, to meet with this brother Sulayman and discuss some of his words in light of what you suggested earlier, may Allah reward you with good, because I know from my life the truth of the saying of the one who said long ago: "The only defect in news is its narrators."
The questioner : May Allah reward you.
The Shaykh : Yes, and therefore I was very pleased with you, first for your honoring us and coming to our home.
The questioner : I seek forgiveness from Allah, and if it were the other way around, it would have been better for me, but not everything a person wishes for comes to pass.
The questioner : Do not deprive us of the reward, O Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : And do not deprive us of the reward.
The Shaykh : May Allah bless you, excuse me, the other one happened, if Allah wills, I was pleased first with your arrival, second with your raising this book and looking into it.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : This is joy upon joy and delight upon delight!
The questioner : May Allah bless you.
The Shaykh : May Allah preserve you, and reading the book now is not easy, but as we said earlier, the people of Makkah know its valleys best; perhaps you will reach the place of the speech that was, as it is said, or as you hinted at, something that you corrected. Can you show us a phrase to clarify the topic!
The questioner : Yes, he did not hint at the speech that it was said when I speak, it was understood from some of my speech that there was mockery of the scholars!
The Shaykh : I am not concerned with this; I am concerned with what you said about the jurisprudence of reality, what is its value in the Shari'ah.
The questioner : May Allah reward you.
The Shaykh : That is it.
The questioner : So I say I wrote an introduction about the scholars' appreciation, so I quoted a statement from His EminenceThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz ibn Baz.
The Shaykh : I read the second line where you acknowledge the virtue of the scholars.
The questioner : Then you quoted a statement from the Shaykh... .
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : Yes, and this is a point I singled out, very necessary... .
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : I said that one should be aware of these facts first, and the speech is connected to us also.
The Shaykh : Very good.
The questioner : First, that the flesh of scholars is poisoned.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : And Allah's sunnah regarding those who belittle them is known, and upon those who track down stumbles and search for faults, let them fear Allah, and especially regarding the scholars of the Ummah and the leaders of the generations. And I remind them of what the distinguished scholar, His Eminence our honorable Shaykh 'Abd al-'Aziz ibn 'Abd Allah ibn 'Abd Allah ibn Baz, said in response to the claim that scholars do not understand reality, where he said: "It is obligatory for the Muslim to guard his tongue from what is not appropriate and not to speak except with insight." So the statement that so-and-so did not understand reality requires knowledge, and it is not said by anyone except one who has knowledge, so that he can judge that so-and-so did not understand reality. As for saying this casually and judging by his opinion without evidence, this is a great abomination that is not permissible, and knowing that the one who issues a fatwa needs evidence, and that is not possible except for the scholars!
The Shaykh : Okay, but this speech, may Allah bless you, has a veiled criticism in it!
The questioner : And it is!
The Shaykh : There are people in it who speak this kind of talk!
The questioner : Yes, there is.
The Shaykh : Fine, among them.
The questioner : There are young men.
The Shaykh : The young men must have drawn this talk from, I mean, a head or
The questioner : Yes, they may draw it from groups you know... you know them. The existence of this matter does not help, O Shaykh.
The Shaykh : We do not know people who use the term "fiqh al-waqi' (jurisprudence of reality)" in all our lives except in this recent period, and consequently, a fortiori, we do not know people who accuse your scholars of ignorance of fiqh al-waqi'. We do not know this at all. And so, I have no objection; I believe what you said, but I clarify that what you are saying does not apply to students of the schools. They do not know the word "fiqh" in Islam, let alone know fiqh al-waqi'!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : This is a modern, invented expression. It may be a good innovation, as you mentioned earlier from some of our brothers. The blessing of innovation, what is the connection...
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh : Yes, and it may be a bad one. The important thing is the talk now.The Shaykh : Here he hints that there are people who accuse some of the Shaykhs!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : of ignorance of reality, and that this is not permissible to say. If there are now people who say this talk, fine, who are these people? If they are students of schools, then these people are not spoken of... students of schools do not pray, do not fast, perhaps, and they commit sins. They are not paid attention to, and there is no weight to their action or their speech... It must be that they have some sway and movement with some individuals such that they trust them and receive from them this slander or these accusations. So they get heated up; they are young men, and they say, "So-and-so the scholar, yes, this is a scholar, but he has no knowledge of fiqh al-waqi'. And if he has no knowledge of fiqh al-waqi', then his fiqh based on the Book and the Sunnah has no value," and so on. May Allah bless you; you must be more knowledgeable about them than we are, the distant ones who ask, "Who are they?" By Allah, we do not know. So the eyes turn to, for example, our brother Sulayman, who hints at, not a person, but persons, and not unknown persons, but by a methodology. I think it reached me; I did not look into it myself. Our brother Dr. Rabie has a writing in this field. He has a book in this field. Did you read it?
The questioner : This last one, did it not come out?
The Shaykh : It did not come out, but nothing has come out.
The questioner : I know a book of hisThe Shaykh : requesting its stoppingThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz and mentioned, and we were present in the council, he said, "I will askThe Shaykh : Rabie to stop this book!"
The questioner : Fine, my intention is, is there nothing in the field published under his name, by his pen?
The questioner : The Shaykh : Rabie.
The Shaykh : Printed, yes.
The questioner : Printed recently, we do not know.
The Shaykh : There is nothing.
The questioner : On these topics, we do not know.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : But.
The questioner : The other: Forgive me, my Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : The other: This talk, O Shaykh, regarding the ignorance of scholars of the knowledge of reality or fiqh al-waqi' is not new. I remember it when I was in the first year of secondary school, meaning this talk was before the year 1402, ten years ago, when Allah granted me guidance and I straightened out. We were with a young man whose concern was that they did not know the seeking of religious knowledge. In the first period of my life, and it was a duration of three years with them... at the mosque, and these were not Tabligh. They raised [people] on nasheeds and acting and the like. So every time we wanted to say we have problems, we... I remember it now, it circles in my ear until this time. We would say, "Fine, we have issues we want to present toThe Shaykh : Ibn Uthaymeen and toThe Shaykh : Ibn Baz, and the answer would come to us!
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : From these people who do not understand... they have no knowledge... by their names... but they influence the youth. The youth fear this fitnah. The days passed, and Allah the Exalted and Majestic granted... so the days passed... so we went to advise them. An issue came to one of them in Ramadan 1410, and he came to me after the tarawih prayer. "And upon you be peace."
The Shaykh : "And upon you be peace and the mercy of Allah and His blessings. Welcome."
The questioner : "The last ten days, eighteen, seventeen." So he spoke to me. I said, "Where are you going, so-and-so?" He said, "I have rehearsals for acting in the theater." I said to him, "In Ramadan?" I said to him, "Fear Allah for yourself," and I warned him with Allah and mentioned... and the neighbor's dispute, and I said, "In any case, I went to a Shaykh who issues a fatwa permitting acting. Ibn Uthaymeen issues a fatwa permitting acting."
The Shaykh : Did you say it, or did he say it to him?
The questioner : I said to him, "Ask him, and he is the one who sees the permissibility of acting?"
The Shaykh : Very good.
The questioner : In this immersion, I assert that he does not support it?
The Shaykh : Although he says.
The questioner : Although he says it is permissible, he also... he said to me in the exact same words: "Ibn Uthaymeen does not know reality." This was before what is called fiqh al-waqi' came out. Then young men from Afghanistan came to us. Then they began to slander our Shaykhs... some of them climb to the third floor of the Sacred Mosque and declare Ibn Baz and Ibn Uthaymeen disbelievers in the middle of the Sacred Mosque!
The Shaykh : Who is he?
The questioner : They declare Ibn Baz and Ibn Uthaymeen disbelievers.
The Shaykh: I mean.
The questioner : They say that they are disbelievers.
The Shaykh : ... I mean the people who say.
The questioner : Those who came from Afghanistan.
The Shaykh : Ah, those who came from Afghanistan.
The questioner : Yes, on the pretext that they are agents of the sultan and that they are agents of the ruler and that they do not understand reality and do not know the reality in which the ummah lives!
The Shaykh : Peace and the mercy of Allah and His blessings. Yes.
The questioner : This fitnah, I mean, we speak by the grace of Allah, no one can appoint himself to confront it or to show that he slanders the scholars. He cannot do that, but it exists. Its cause is old matters and considerations, but there remain young men in the councils. A messageThe Shaykh : I am here, and confirming the awakening is good.
The Shaykh: Ah, okay.
The questioner : The Shaykh : It does not address students of knowledge. I am not defendingThe Shaykh The Shaykh : There is one who defends himself!
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : I mean, it does not address great, prominent students of knowledge. It says, "You, these young men, are falling into pitfalls... Fear Allah for yourselves. You are taking from us, O Nasser al-'Umar, unfortunately, and O Salman al-'Udah, and O Safer al-Hawali, and O 'A'ish al-Qarni, more than you take from Al-Albani and more than you take from Ibn Baz. And we return to you, saying to you, 'Fear Allah, do not slander the scholars... these scholars.' These are the leaders of the masters. And I do not like to speak in your face because Abu Badr... I mean, his direction is to the youth and his saying, 'Stick to the scholars.' And if you wish to read, if time permits you to read in "The Necessity of Knowledge as a Legal Requirement," and you will also find encouragement of the youth to continue in knowledge!
The Shaykh : May Allah reward him with good.
The questioner : And I do not say it in his face.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : But it happens from what I warned about.The Shaykh : Nasser, and I said to him in the exact same words, and this talk... from the self to him... because he falls into matters that make people interpret them contrary to what he intends. Fine!
The Shaykh : Good.
The questioner : Contrary to what he intends. We know the sincerity of his intention, but we catch him by his finger with what his hand has earned. So fine, he is...The Shaykh : Salman, his lectures are not written at all; they are transcribed tapes, andThe Shaykh : Salman is not likeThe Shaykh : Nasser... and I know this thing.The Shaykh : Salman... more thanThe Shaykh : Nasser... so he reviews it round after round, looking at his engagements and the many visitors to him here. He says, for example, and you find a third category. I read to you from what I meant by "scientific Islam." They learn the Sunnah and hadith, and they work on distinguishing the authentic from the defective... in narrating weak and fabricated hadiths, and this may be accompanied by roughness or weakness in worship or heedlessness of the reality of the ummah.
The Shaykh : A mistake.
The questioner : It is accompanied by some roughness.
The Shaykh : A typographical or verbal error.
The questioner : No, verbal, from the roughness or weakness in worship or heedlessness of the reality of the ummah.
The Shaykh : This book is for Salman.
The questioner : Salman al-Oudah.
The Shaykh : Ah, Salman.
The questioner : I say to the ShaykhThe Shaykh : Salman. We know him, but we cannot defend him because he is being sued for what his hand has written. Fine.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : So how, and he himself wrote this thing now...
The Shaykh : Fine, did you not review it?
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : You did not review it.
The questioner : NowThe Shaykh : He says, "Review it after me," meaning...
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : The other: If you permit me, O Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : The other:The Shaykh : Salman. I point to two points.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : The other: The issue that they say he is a Saruri and a Muslim Brotherhood member!
The Shaykh : And upon you be peace and the mercy and blessings of Allah.
The questioner : The other: I knowThe Shaykh : Salman is not a Muslim Brotherhood member, and I almost swear to it. I knowThe Shaykh : Salman!
The Shaykh : He is not a Muslim Brotherhood member and not a Saruri!
The questioner : The other: Yes, I swear to it.
The Shaykh : But there is a reality.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : This is what we hope to gain from you, either negatively, as I hope, or positively, if we are to be sorry. It may not be brotherly, but his methodology is brotherly. First, do you distinguish between the two with me? That is, it is not brotherly, but his methodology is brotherly!
The questioner : The other: I mean, does this apply to a specific person?
The Shaykh : Allow me.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Do you distinguish between the two with me?
The questioner : The other: Yes, I distinguish.
The Shaykh: All right.
The questioner : The other: Yes.
The Shaykh : May Allah reward you, if you swore that he is not brotherly and is not, and you are not obligated to swear, and there is no need for that!
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : But the important matter is that he not be brotherly.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : The important matter is that his methodology not be brotherly. So here, the question is: do you not feel that his methodology is brotherly?
The questioner : The other: By Allah, absolutely not.
The questioner : I do not see it.
The Shaykh : Uttering this corrupts...
The questioner : There may be, O Shaykh, issues, yes, there may be.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : From which it is understood that he follows.
The Shaykh : That he.
The questioner : He follows such speech as you said.
The Shaykh: All right.
The questioner : But isThe Shaykh : his methodology brotherly? This is your statement, O Shaykh, and it is very important, because the issue is one of methodology, not names!
The Shaykh : That is it!
The questioner : Names change, but methodologies remain.
The Shaykh : Therefore, may Allah reward you.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : You should not be too enthusiastic in saying that I swear he is not brotherly; nothing is gained from that!
The questioner : And even his methodology.
The Shaykh : The important thing is that his methodology not be the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. So I am giving you an example now!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Clarifying my question, and thereby you clarify to me the reality you perceive from our brother Sulayman!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Or Salman. I am giving you an example now from our Salafi brothers. I am like you in that I am certain he is not brotherly, but his methodology is brotherly, and he is a Salafi. I do not think you know him well, and he is 'Abd al-Rahman 'Abd al-Khalq!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Do you know him?
The questioner : I know him.
The Shaykh : Good, he is my student at the Islamic University!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And when he was, he was brotherly, and if the expression is correct, he became a Salafi there at the university!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And he was among the best of the youth who were aware of the lessons and methodologies, and so on. I say, as you say about Salman, that he is not brotherly, but his methodology is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. How is that? First, it is partisanship and bloc formation. Do you not know this!
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : 'Abd al-Rahman.
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : Fine, this partisanship and this bloc formation is not on the Salafi methodology that we call to, is it not so!
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Well, then, if Salman, who is being discussed now in this speech and in others, we say about him that he is not brotherly, and we are truthful, but that does not exempt him from having a methodology that is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. Here, the caution is that he is not brotherly, but his methodology is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. So I am asking you now: do you feel from him that he blocs people and blocs the youth and encourages them in the way the Muslim Brotherhood encourages their helpers and companions, and so on? I said in the previous session that the methodology of the Brotherhood is to bloc, then to educate, then nothing. There is nothing in it but blind bloc formation, no education and nothing. As proof, nearly a century has passed for the Muslim Brotherhood in various countries, and they have not moved from the military system, because their methodology suggests this to them. They do not advance, not in knowledge, not in creed, not in behavior, as they are exactly. You cannot find a brother of the Muslim Brotherhood who follows the methodology of the Sunnah, at least outwardly. You find one of them imitating Hassan al-Banna, taking from his beard and making it as some Hanafi jurists say in the books of the Hanafis, as the non-Arabs or the Moroccans do. They are concerned with following Hassan al-Banna, and it is not in their minds to follow the Master of the Prophets (peace and blessings be upon him). So now, is there any of this bloc formation and this gathering of the youth? This happened in Kuwait before the incident happened to them, so 'Abd al-Rahman and those around him became preoccupied with the education of the group and teaching them and raising them with Islamic upbringing because of this partisanship and this bloc formation. And this is one of the effects of secular partisanship. Do you hear now the problem that saddens every Muslim heart? What happened to our brothers in Algeria. Our brothers in Algeria have enthusiasm for the Muslim Brotherhood, but they have absolutely no education. Then they bloced, they gathered millions around them, but most of them do not understand, most of them do not know except the heat of the youth. We want a Muslim state. "And whoever hastens a thing before its time is tried with its deprivation," as you know. So, may Allah reward you, it is not necessary that we purify a person's name by his personhood that he is brotherly, but the important thing is to purify him from having a methodology that is the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood. The Muslim Brotherhood, you do not find a Salafi among their heads, as I told you about 'Asim, he is a Salafi, about 'Isam, he is a Salafi in his creed, but he does not call. Meanwhile, we know about Salman and all our brothers, may Allah will it, that they call to the Book and the Sunnah and the methodology of the pious predecessors. But if the methodology of the Muslim Brotherhood seeps into them in terms of bloc formation and gathering, then it becomes great for the Salafi methodology, and it will become... So I hope now that I understand from you that the answer should match the reality of the man, that even in his methodology, he does not bloc the youth and does not gather them, but rather he educates them and teaches them, as is obligatory upon every caller.
The questioner : What I know aboutThe Shaykh : Salman is that he is not brotherly, and his methodology is not from the methodology of the Brotherhood!
The Shaykh: All right.
The questioner : But his methodology, according to my knowledge, is the methodology of the people of the Sunnah and the community. It is the methodology of the Salaf of this Ummah in his teaching and his knowledge. And what I know, O Shaykh, the last news that reached himThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz, and he gave him permission that he would start and established what is called a competition for memorizing the Sunnah, on the model of the Qur'an, andThe Shaykh : 'Abd al-'Aziz himself approved, and he has a number of students who are memorizing the two Sahihs, and he has seven lessons per week!
The Shaykh: Yes.
The questioner : Most of them are in hadith and in the Sunnah, most of them, and he does not have a general lesson except one lesson per week, and it is a lesson you see and hear its tapes in it...
The Shaykh : Yes.
The questioner : This, if I sayThe Shaykh : Salman has no affiliation and no methodology from the methodology of the Brotherhood, this is what I know about him!
The Shaykh : But these words do not meet...!
The questioner : Here, O Shaykh, here I say, I said a little while ago, what did I say? You may make mistakes. I say that this is a mistake, and I am certain that if I discussedThe Shaykh : Salman for a different point of view...
The Shaykh : But it seems that it is not only in this sentence that he has a lot of that thing, for what he distinguishes between...
Source
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