Continuation of the discussion regarding Shaykh Safar and some observations about him that are thought to contradict the methodology of the pious predecessors.

The Shaykh : His saying (peace be upon him): I have listened to many, many tapes of this man, just as I have listened to the other brother, Salman al-Oudah. I took issue with Salman al-Oudah on some matters, yet we do not exclude him from the circle in which we live and exist, ever. As for this one, I have not taken issue with him for anything until now, except for a word he uttered regarding the demonstrations that took place in Algeria. He described them as a release of pressure for a people who are being oppressed by disbelief and misguidance. The brother says that he takes pride in this manner of expression. This is attributing to the words what they do not bear. This is not what should be done, may Allah reward you.

The questioner : I see that it is taking pride, and that he is celebrating it, especially since he has other words in another tape. He was asked about the ruling on demonstrations in calling to Allah in another lecture, and what is the ruling on one killed in them—whether he is a martyr. The clip is available and recorded on this tape. The question, then the answer. After a long speech, he said something like this: it goes and comes, it goes and comes. Then he said, yes, it is one of the methods of da'wah, and the one killed in it is in the path of Allah. For this reason, based on what I know about him—this question, then another question, and I know, for example, of his followers who promote demonstrations and see them as a method, and they debate for their sake—I know all of this, and I conclude that he takes pride and boasts, mentioning that 700,000 women went out, and they went out demanding the hijab, demanding this, demanding that.

The Shaykh : Perhaps this is the text you are speaking about now.

The questioner : ... .

The Shaykh : Be patient. Perhaps this is the text you are speaking about, and it supports your understanding mentioned earlier, in this tape we just heard. Perhaps there is a response to this that would be a response to that. It is not permissible for you to rely solely on your own understanding of something, and on the basis of that understanding, to oppose this Muslim man who calls to the Book and the Sunnah and to the methodology of the pious predecessors. I say, perhaps? Is this tape available to you so that we can study it?

The questioner: Yes.

The Shaykh : Bring it, bring it.

The questioner : But the clip is available. This question, yes, it is available.
Shuqara: Brother Khalid, do you think that a brother like Safar and others like him among the callers to Allah—do you think that it is not permissible for them to err in what they say?

The questioner : This is not the subject of the discussion.
Shuqara: Just a question.

The questioner : I do not consider it an error; I consider it a deviation.
Shuqara: Answer my question.

The questioner : They do not err, and they hit the mark.
Shuqara: Very good. I want to say the greatest thing I can describe Safar with regarding what you said about him, if no words from our Shaykh have come to refute it, and it is possible that what came regarding his previous words that we mentioned may come. He says, my brother, Safar, you have made a great error; you should return and turn away from it. This is possible.

The questioner : And we criticize him and say this is an error, or we defend him if it is correct.
Shuqara: I tell you, on the assumption that such words as were said in your question mentioned earlier have not come to him, we do not want to discuss, and we do not want to enter with him into correctness or error... This is something different from this.

The questioner : The important thing is that the one who errs returns from his error, whether it is us or him.
Shuqara: Brother Abu Jaber, I do not believe that Safar is among the people who lean on [their status] and are arrogant about the truth.

The questioner : As for me, I believe that he is arrogant...

The Shaykh: There is no power nor strength except with Allah.

The questioner : I know about this, and I will ask about what you said, and you will ask about what you said. You testify to what you know, and I testify to what I know.
Shuqara: I tell you something. I am ready that after a week from now, next week, if Allah wills, I will come to Jeddah and meet with Safar, because this issue, may Allah reward you, if it spreads among us, and I say that he is not arrogant, and you say he is arrogant, this is a contradiction, this is a conflict, this is not a difference of variety. So I judge him differently from how you judge him. I may be wrong if you are right, and you may be wrong if I am right. But the decisive judgment between us in this issue is his tongue alone. We will bring him, oh Safar, like this, like this. Do you believe, religiously and in terms of da'wah, that the demonstrations taking place in the lands of the Muslims are a method of da'wah, despite the fact that they bring nothing but evil, and that blood is shed in them, and that souls are extinguished in them, and that groups are killed in them, and that the work of da'wah is buried?

The Shaykh : And that da'wah is delayed by this method.
Shuqara: We say, answer this question with all its parts. If he says, I believe that these demonstrations are a method of da'wah, and I testify to Allah by it, we will bring him, and by Allah, my brother, you are a criminal. We will not bring him. You are wrong, you are a criminal, we will punish him at that time.

The questioner : Why don't you say something else?

The Shaykh : I am saying now, on behalf of Khalid, that Khalid will say, if this question is directed to Safar, he will say, far be it from Allah. Khalid says this.

The questioner : I know he will say this. I tell you, my Shaykh, this is a trial now.

The Shaykh : Allow me, let me understand your words. That you agreed with me on what I said about you.

The questioner : He will deny it and say, no, far be it, and I do not say that demonstrations are a method of da'wah.

The Shaykh : No, no, allow me. We need something from him now to preserve him. Meaning, you now want to say that he says with his tongue what is not in his heart, and we did not intend this. Of course, we will say when the matter is clarified to him with this clarification by the professor here, Abu Malik, he will say from the bottom of his heart, far be it from Allah that I be among the ignorant. I seek refuge in Allah that I be among the ignorant. I said that you, and you, Khalid, will say with my words. This is not saying that he says with his tongue what is not in his heart.
Shuqara: This is hypocrisy. Meaning, you are accusing him of being a hypocrite...

The questioner : Do not attribute to my words more than they can bear. I did not say that.

The Shaykh : I attributed to your words what they cannot bear.

The questioner : I do not object to the word. I accuse him of hypocrisy. For me, hypocrisy is practical and creedal. He is practically a hypocrite, and there is no doubt in that for me.
Shuqara: I never said creedal hypocrisy.

The questioner : I am satisfied with one thing, may Allah reward you, which is that if he decides it is an error and says that he is wrong, I believe in the apparent state of the man, and I wish him safety, but only I want him to retract publicly, as he erred publicly before people, that he retract publicly before people, that this is an error, and that demonstrations are not a method of da'wah. And I thank him and say, and I accept his head, and I say to him, may Allah reward you with good.

The Shaykh : No, allow me, but I noticed what he said. If he decides it is his error, they insist, meaning.

The questioner : On the assumption.

The Shaykh : Oh Shaykh, oh people, fear Allah (Mighty and Majestic) The issue is not agreed upon in this small council that the man erred, until you say to the professor, if you decide it is his error.

The questioner : On the condition that he is wrong, because he is the one who raised this possibility.

The Shaykh : No, no, he depicted the error as concrete, such that the most ignorant of people and the least of people would say, I seek refuge in Allah from that. And you imagine that this caller, the good Muslim man, you say, it is possible he says, I call to such demonstrations.

The questioner : I do not say this.

The Shaykh : You do not say this, but my brother, take it easy. Do not be too enthusiastic about an understanding that seems to you. Meaning, is this man's good more, or his evil?

The questioner : His evil.

The Shaykh : I seek refuge in Allah, by Allah, I...

The questioner : Regarding what has appeared to us of his method in da'wah, his evil is more.
Shuqara: Our Shaykh, our brother Khalid, may Allah preserve him and bless him, holds in our hearts the place of a beloved, kind brother who is among the best of our brothers. He also brought us some brothers we did not know, and he added to our love for him another love, or rather gratitude to Allah that he brought those brothers whom we came to love by their presence. So our love for him increased and did not decrease, and praise be to Allah. But as for brother Khalid, from our experience with him in the first instance and this one, I do not say he will not back down or that he does not want to, for example, we are the entire Islamic world, our Shaykh, who knows what merit you have, and we are, in our estimation, and Allah knows best, the people who know your merit best, praise be to Allah, Lord of the worlds. But I say, our Shaykh, if the discussion proceeds in this manner, we will not derive any benefit. Therefore, I see that we should turn away from this discussion about this man, because it appears that brother Khalid has convictions regarding this brother that are difficult to extract from himself. So I see that we should steer the discussion toward other scholarly discussions, in which there may be a clearer and greater benefit than the benefit we are discussing here. With the understanding that this does not diminish our love for Khalid in our eyes, because what drives him to this is not passion, if Allah wills, but rather love for the good of the Muslims. And this also does not turn us away from our position regarding brother Safar, because we firmly believe that he is among the best of the callers to Allah in this time, and Allah knows best.

The Shaykh : But we want for him good and justice, and we see that he is being harsh. Indeed, out of our complete love for him, we do not want him to be harsh toward those we love for the sake of Allah, even if we have not yet seen them.
Shuqara: And the ear sometimes loves before the eye.

The questioner : Shaykh, if you would listen to the various clips, perhaps they would support some of what our brother Khalid went to, I do not say all of what he went to. Perhaps we would find in them something that indicates or strengthens this doubt, if it is a doubt or a suspicion, so that we may clarify it. Out of complete advice, we should listen to everything he said and refute it.
Shuqara: This reminds me of his letter with brother Ali... in the book *Wasail Daf' al-Ghurba* (Means of Dispelling Loneliness), our brother Ali Khushan, regarding...
Al-Halabi : *Wasail Daf' al-Ghurba*, the book of brother Salman, *Wasail Daf' al-Ghurba*, when he was reading it and they latched onto it.
Shuqara: It reminds us of his sessions with brother Khalid.
Al-Halabi : In a reverse manner.
Shuqara: That is his final position.

The Shaykh : And what is your opinion if the two of them met?
Shuqara: At that time, our Shaykh, we will see who is behind the veil.
Al-Halabi : Our Shaykh, Subhan Allah al-Azim, there you noticed an excess in love and you refuted it, and here you noticed an excess in refutation and you refuted it, so...The Shaykh : May Allah reward him with good for his fairness and justice. And this is the methodology of the people of hadith; they say what is in their favor and they say what is against them.

The Shaykh : And he is also our relative and our brother-in-law, so we should seek to excuse him.
Shuqara: This matter, brother Khalid, truly, for the sake of fairness, we say that we listened to your tapes. I listened to some of the tapes, I do not say all the tapes, I listened to some of the tapes that brother Salman recorded. Truly, I am Safar and Salman also, but I did not find it to be true as our Shaykh said regarding some of your criticisms of Salman. Some of your criticisms were correct, but as for this one regarding Safar, I do not know. Knowing that criticism does not prevent, meaning the truth, criticism does not prevent the truth, nor does it prevent exposing falsehood, but on the condition that we seek to excuse our brother on one hand, and on the other hand, we do not reach a degree where it feels that we hate this person and do not love him.

The questioner : We hate him for the sake of Allah according to what he has of evil, and we love him for the sake of Allah according to what he has of good. I do not think I am being harsh toward Safar.
Shuqara: Love and hate do not coexist; they are opposites that do not coexist until the Day of Resurrection.

The questioner : I mean, this happens, and Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah established this statement in the *Fatawa* in many places, that we love a person according to what he has of good and we hate him according to what he has of evil, unless I have not read what Shaykh al-Islam said and did not understand it. If our Shaykh, this issue, meaning the issue of love and hate, is clarified among the people of the Sunnah.

The Shaykh : I have nothing. We accept this from him. So if you love him for the sake of Allah...

The questioner : According to what he has of good, there is no doubt. I only hate him...

The Shaykh : Why don't you specify the good that he has?

The questioner : Now, for example, one of the goods he has is that he calls to Islam.

The Shaykh : May Allah guide you. Is this the answer to my question?

The questioner : What is the answer you want? But it is the answer I think is an answer to your question.

The Shaykh : May Allah guide you. That is not my question.

The questioner : Why don't you specify the good that he has?

The Shaykh : Did you specify it with your answer?

The questioner : I think so, my Shaykh.

The Shaykh : My brother, this answer is suitable for the most wicked of people. May Allah guide you. This is suitable for the most wicked of people. As long as he is a Muslim, this answer is not permissible.
Shuqara: This is suitable even for a disbeliever.

The Shaykh : Let him be satisfied with being a Muslim.
Shuqara: Faris al-Khouri did not stand and defend Islam in the Security Council. Faris al-Khouri was the Minister of Foreign Affairs for Syria, and he raised his voice in defense of Islam and praised Islam and its people, and he was Faris al-Khouri.

The Shaykh : Allah is sufficient for me, and He is the best Disposer of affairs.

The questioner : I lean toward the brother's opinion that we listen to his speech, and this will not harm us. We only listen. I mean, do these observations that are recorded on this tape, for example, support what brother Khalid said and you agreed with him on?

The Shaykh : No, I see that this has no end.

The questioner : My Shaykh, allow me, my Shaykh, let us develop this suggestion. I will copy these tapes for you and leave them with you so you can listen to them in your free time, between you and yourself. The matter does not require, I mean, if you see it, it can help you, and the picture is fragmented.