Is it permissible to trim the beard other than for Hajj or 'Umrah? And is the statement of a Companion a proof when there is disagreement with him?

Al-Huwaini: As for me, I heard yesterday someone mentioning a fatwa from you stating that it is permissible to trim the beard other than for Hajj or 'Umrah. Is this correct?

The Shaykh : Yes, it is correct.
Al-Huwaini: Yes, it is correct. So, what is the evidence for that?

The Shaykh : The actions of the Companions.
Al-Huwaini: Does that mean you can mention examples, if you remember, of what the Companions did?

The Shaykh : The action of Ibn 'Umar, for it is established from him that he trimmed, both restricted to Hajj and 'Umrah and without such a restriction; and likewise, it is reported from some of the Companions and the Successors, such as Abu Hurayrah and Mujahid and others. This is what I recall at the moment.
Al-Huwaini: But some who hold a different opinion say that the action of a Companion is not a proof, especially if it is contradicted. They mentioned, with a sound chain to 'Ali ibn Abi Talib (may Allah be pleased with him), that his beard reached his navel and filled the space between his cheeks. He said, and it appears from the rest of the Companions that they did not practice trimming the beard, because this is contrary to the saying of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) . Therefore, trimming is contrary to leaving it long, so we have the apparent text, and we do not go beyond it.

The Shaykh : Yes. First, who narrated this report with the sound chain?
Al-Huwaini: I do not know; I am a transmitter.

The Shaykh : Well, who mentioned it?
Al-Huwaini: I do not know either; but if it is authentic?

The Shaykh : If it is authentic, then there is disagreement among the Companions on this issue, which means one Companion among the Companions; in that case, the issue falls under the scope of independent legal reasoning and dispute. But I do not see expanding on the topic before verifying the authenticity of this report. You must trust the one who mentioned this report and verified its chain.
Al-Huwaini: I mean, I trust his transmission; he does not exercise independent legal reasoning from his own side; he is just a transmitter who says, "I read such and such and such."

The Shaykh : But he—may Allah bless you—is not just a matter of transmission. Who said its chain is sound? Is it him or the one he transmitted from?
Al-Huwaini: The one he transmitted from.

The Shaykh : Who is the one he transmitted from? Is he one of the Imams of hadith? One of the authenticators and critics?
Al-Huwaini: I do not know, I do not know.

The Shaykh : So, is he transmitting from an unknown person?
Al-Huwaini: No, he is transmitting from a book that I have forgotten. I forgot the book he transmitted from.

The Shaykh : Well, who is the transmitter?
Al-Huwaini: A brother of ours in Egypt. Should I name him or is there no need?

The Shaykh : No, if there is backbiting in it, do not name him.
Al-Huwaini: No, there is no backbiting in it.

The Shaykh : Then name him.
Laughter.The Shaykh : and the students
Al-Huwaini: The brother is Abu 'Abd al-Rahman Ibrahim ibn 'Abd Allah. He is one of those engaged with hadith.

The Shaykh : Does Ibrahim ibn 'Abd Allah have any reports?
Al-Huwaini: This brother?

The Shaykh : Of course, he is not anyone else.
Al-Huwaini: Like a book or something similar.

The Shaykh : Yes, a thesis or a book.
Al-Huwaini: Yes, he has a book titled "The Meanings and Foundations Between al-Ghazali and al-Albani," which discusses the statementThe Shaykh : of al-Ghazali in the introduction to *Fiqh al-Sirah*: "I take the spirit of the hadith and I do not take its text." So he discusses the meaning and foundation of the hadith in light of this point. And he has a book *Irwaa' al-Thalim*...

The Shaykh : And what does it end with?
Al-Huwaini: Yes, it ends with the necessity of stopping at the foundation. That is, if the foundation supports the meaning, welcome, but I do not permit myself to expand and reject authentic hadiths on the claim that the meaning does not match the hadith.

The Shaykh : Yes, and does he have anything else?
Al-Huwaini: He has a book titled "Irwaa' al-Thalim with the Takhrij of Sunan al-Darimi."

The Shaykh : Are these things published, or are they still in the realm of manuscripts?
Al-Huwaini: No, it is still in the realm of manuscripts.

The Shaykh : And did you read what you transmitted from him in his book, or did he tell you?
Al-Huwaini: I heard it.

The Shaykh : Did you also hear it as a transmission from him?
Al-Huwaini: A transmission from hearing.

The Shaykh : Then it is a broken chain narration.
Laughter.The Shaykh .
Al-Huwaini: Or a suspended narration.
Al-Huwaini laughs andThe Shaykh .

The Shaykh : No, do you trust this intermediary?
Al-Huwaini: He.

The Shaykh : No, the intermediary who transmitted it to you?
Al-Huwaini: No, I do not trust him.

The Shaykh : That is the point. In any case, we are stopping now because the authenticity of such a report is very unlikely.
Al-Huwaini: But our Shaykh, if it were established and the actions of the Companions conflicted, would not returning to the apparent text be preferable?

The Shaykh : No, there is something here I will mention to you. The issue is completely different from some issues where some of the Salaf contradict the apparent text.The Shaykh : Ibn Baz, of course, revolves around the obligation of adhering to the apparent text. He says in his commentary on the *Risalah al-Kandahlawi*; have you seen it or not?
Al-Huwayni: Yes.

The Shaykh : He does not consider the contradiction of the Companions. This is, in my opinion, very dangerous speech. If you doubted the authenticity of attributing that to the Companions, it would be more acceptable. But how can we imagine these Companions, and at their head Ibn 'Umar, that we say of him that either he did not understand the generality of the text or its universality; or that with his understanding, he contradicted the Sunnah of the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him), even though among the Companions, he is the unique, sole one known for his exaggeration and strictness in following the actions of the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him), even those that were not from the devotional Sunnahs? So it is far-fetched to say that someone like Ibn 'Umar, who is so eager to follow the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) and accompanied him for as many years as Allah willed, seeing the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) match his words with his actions and his actions with his words, would then come and contradict both the word and the action. This is the furthest thing from such a Companion. One might assume such a contradiction from the Companions who were Bedouins, for example, who came to the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him), believed in him, heard some advice or some issues from him, and then returned to their sheep, their camels, their desert. But as for Ibn 'Umar, who accompanied the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) and had that strange, intense eagerness in following him (peace and blessings be upon him), even in what others see as not being following at all, but his love led him to exaggeration in following the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) in what is not a Sunnah; it is very difficult to imagine that this man would come to something he sees the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) doing and confirming with his word: . And then he would not pardon and contradict what he saw in the Messenger and what he heard from the Messenger. And in my belief, no person of intellect and reason doubts that this address, which the Companion hears in general and Ibn 'Umar in particular, directly from the mouth of the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) to his ear, will be more understandable to him than any other man who comes in the end of time or in the past, but did not hear it directly from the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him).
Al-Huwaini: They, our Shaykh, restricted it to Hajj and 'Umrah only.

The Shaykh : No, no, I told you just now that both this and that are established from him. Then this is an issue that could become between you and me, for example. For example, you see the taking of Ibn 'Umar's action in Hajj and 'Umrah for the reason you mentioned; butThe Shaykh : Ibn Baz and those like him do not differentiate; because this is the action of Ibn 'Umar. So the topic now is not the topic of restriction or universality in Hajj and 'Umrah or absolutely; the topic now is that whether the trimming is in Hajj and 'Umrah or in other cases, in the view of Ibn Baz and other scholars, there is no difference in this and that. All of it contradicts the text, in their concept. Therefore, we do not enter into the details now, although I answered you that the universality is established from him. This restriction is not a restriction but rather a part of the parts of the general text. So this is my view on the topic.
The student : But our Shaykh, regarding your fatwa, some people exploit it to the extent that their beards are like this, barely visible.

The Shaykh : Like what al-Kandahlawi said, like grains of rice.
Laughter.The Shaykh .
Al-Huwaini: It is so, so they do not appear, especially the Muslim with the provision of the beard and that it be full and so on.

The Shaykh : Yes, but we still say to leave it long and set a limit for it so that the Muslim does not exceed it, which is what is established from Ibn 'Umar.
Al-Huwaini: Which is the handful.

The Shaykh : Yes, exactly.
Al-Huwaini: So, it seems the summary of the fatwa is that after the handful, he does not trim.

The Shaykh : Yes, exactly.
Al-Huwaini: If we go back, we go back to the restriction.

The Shaykh : What restriction?
Al-Huwayni: The one who, when he performed Hajj or 'Umrah.

The Shaykh : No, no, may Allah reward you. We have two conditions here: a temporal condition and a spatial condition; one condition relates to the beard, and one condition relates to time. Since we are discussing the beard now, that has no relation to this.
Al-Huwayni: So it has become clear, it has become clear.

The Shaykh : Praise be to Allah.