Not every act that appears to be disbelief indicates that its doer is a disbeliever.
Machine translationRead the Arabic original
The Shaykh : The important point is that these absolute statements are wrong!
The questioner : I mean, does it make a difference whether the person is knowledgeable or ignorant? The act?
The Shaykh : It differs in one respect!
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Do you know the story narrated in the books of exegesis about 'Amir ibn Yasir, who was tortured along with Bilal, and they said to him: "If you say that the Messenger Muhammad is a sorcerer, a liar, and a poet, we will release you"? Have you heard this story?
The questioner : Yes, I have heard it.
The Shaykh : The verse that was revealed on this occasion is the saying of Allah the Exalted:[An-Nahl 16:106]. The point now is: I am returning the question you directed to me back to you, and your heart is saying: [Yusuf 12:65]. Was 'Amir ibn Yasir ignorant or knowledgeable?
The questioner : Knowledgeable.
The Shaykh : Okay, did he become a disbeliever?
The questioner : No.
The Shaykh : So?
The questioner : His heart was at rest with faith. May Allah reward you with good.
The questioner : I mean, you might pass by this knowledgeable person who is being talked about; he might say something while his heart is at rest with faith, but he is forced to do this act. We do not declare him a disbeliever; he is forced, he is coerced.
The Shaykh : That is the point. Not every act indicates that the doer is a disbeliever; it must be detailed. And as they say today in the language of the modern era, regarding the cleverness of today's youth, their attachment to knowledge, and their rushing before they are ready: not every act indicates that it is disbelief.
Therefore, I directed in my time, in some of my sessions and discussions: If you see a man take the mushaf and trample it with his feet, what do you say about him?
Now it is directed to you, you who asked the previous questions: Is he a disbeliever or not?
The questioner : He is a disbeliever.
The Shaykh : He did not benefit anything. You need to build very strong bridges before answering.
The questioner : I mean, practical disbelief.
The Shaykh : See, do you see how it is?
The questioner : Fix it, detail it.
The Shaykh : Disbelief. You are saying now, "practical disbelief," which is without doubt. But my question was: Is it apostasy? And now I am telling you frankly: Did he apostatize from his religion?
And you see with your own eyes that he placed the mushaf under his foot and crushed it and trampled it. Did he apostatize from his religion?
The questioner : I say, O Shaykh, he is a disbeliever.
The Shaykh : Huh?
The questioner : I say, and Allah knows best, that it is disbelief.
The Shaykh : I am asking: Did he apostatize or not?
The questioner : He apostatized.
The Shaykh : Your companion says before you, but he is afraid to say it, because your companion, look now how the issue requires deliberation.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : You are saying like Abu Ramz, of course, because the issue is very clear. I say, wait, be careful. I say this is disbelief if we first rule out coercion, which was the subject of the previous discussion, meaning he did it by his own choice, and then he is knowledgeable that this book is the Noble Qur'an.
The questioner : If he says that the Qur'an is created!
The Shaykh : Be patient, do not branch out the topic.
The questioner : Okay.
The Shaykh : Until the first issue is finished. Now it is clear to you that it is not permissible to say: "Disbelief" meaning "apostasy"? There are possibilities.
The questioner : You are right.
The Shaykh : When all these possibilities are removed, it is said: This is creedal disbelief. And where are these people of takfir and where is their knowledge?
These are very superficial people, meaning they learned some letters of knowledge and thought they had become the masters of scholars. And this is arrogance: the plague of the present era is arrogance and self-conceit, may Allah protect us from it.
I am saying something else: and be careful, here, what you saw previously is enough for you. I am warning you.
The questioner : May Allah bless you.
The questioner : I mean, does it make a difference whether the person is knowledgeable or ignorant? The act?
The Shaykh : It differs in one respect!
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Do you know the story narrated in the books of exegesis about 'Amir ibn Yasir, who was tortured along with Bilal, and they said to him: "If you say that the Messenger Muhammad is a sorcerer, a liar, and a poet, we will release you"? Have you heard this story?
The questioner : Yes, I have heard it.
The Shaykh : The verse that was revealed on this occasion is the saying of Allah the Exalted:
except for one who is forced [to renounce his religion] while his heart is secure in faith
إلا من أُكره وقلبه مطمئن بالإيمانThis is our merchandise returned to us
هذه بضاعتنا ردت إليناThe questioner : Knowledgeable.
The Shaykh : Okay, did he become a disbeliever?
The questioner : No.
The Shaykh : So?
The questioner : His heart was at rest with faith. May Allah reward you with good.
The questioner : I mean, you might pass by this knowledgeable person who is being talked about; he might say something while his heart is at rest with faith, but he is forced to do this act. We do not declare him a disbeliever; he is forced, he is coerced.
The Shaykh : That is the point. Not every act indicates that the doer is a disbeliever; it must be detailed. And as they say today in the language of the modern era, regarding the cleverness of today's youth, their attachment to knowledge, and their rushing before they are ready: not every act indicates that it is disbelief.
Therefore, I directed in my time, in some of my sessions and discussions: If you see a man take the mushaf and trample it with his feet, what do you say about him?
Now it is directed to you, you who asked the previous questions: Is he a disbeliever or not?
The questioner : He is a disbeliever.
The Shaykh : He did not benefit anything. You need to build very strong bridges before answering.
The questioner : I mean, practical disbelief.
The Shaykh : See, do you see how it is?
The questioner : Fix it, detail it.
The Shaykh : Disbelief. You are saying now, "practical disbelief," which is without doubt. But my question was: Is it apostasy? And now I am telling you frankly: Did he apostatize from his religion?
And you see with your own eyes that he placed the mushaf under his foot and crushed it and trampled it. Did he apostatize from his religion?
The questioner : I say, O Shaykh, he is a disbeliever.
The Shaykh : Huh?
The questioner : I say, and Allah knows best, that it is disbelief.
The Shaykh : I am asking: Did he apostatize or not?
The questioner : He apostatized.
The Shaykh : Your companion says before you, but he is afraid to say it, because your companion, look now how the issue requires deliberation.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : You are saying like Abu Ramz, of course, because the issue is very clear. I say, wait, be careful. I say this is disbelief if we first rule out coercion, which was the subject of the previous discussion, meaning he did it by his own choice, and then he is knowledgeable that this book is the Noble Qur'an.
The questioner : If he says that the Qur'an is created!
The Shaykh : Be patient, do not branch out the topic.
The questioner : Okay.
The Shaykh : Until the first issue is finished. Now it is clear to you that it is not permissible to say: "Disbelief" meaning "apostasy"? There are possibilities.
The questioner : You are right.
The Shaykh : When all these possibilities are removed, it is said: This is creedal disbelief. And where are these people of takfir and where is their knowledge?
These are very superficial people, meaning they learned some letters of knowledge and thought they had become the masters of scholars. And this is arrogance: the plague of the present era is arrogance and self-conceit, may Allah protect us from it.
I am saying something else: and be careful, here, what you saw previously is enough for you. I am warning you.
The questioner : May Allah bless you.