A long question, the substance of which is that a man works for a company that deals in riba (usury or interest)
Machine translationRead the Arabic original
The questioner : Regarding a person who is a manager in a company; this company has established a financial portfolio, consisting of funds and a large sum of money. This person learned that there was an objection to entering into riba (usury or interest) avenues, so he came to me to ask.
The Shaykh: Good.
The questioner : Should I stay in this company? Or do you think I should leave my responsibility in this portfolio? Through our discussion about what is lawful and what is forbidden, it became clear that with this man’s presence, he might be able to direct this portfolio, not entirely, but let us say, for example, forty-five million or forty million of the total portfolio amount, toward genuine investment avenues, away from the rest of the amount, which is invested in financial instruments that may include some riba (usury or interest) avenues. Is it obligatory for this person, who has this ability to influence this portfolio in this direction, to remain while some avenues remain in an investment where riba (usury or interest) is mixed in? Or should he purify himself and leave this company’s portfolio? Or should he stay and strive to correct the course of this portfolio?
The Shaykh : There is no doubt that the answer must be immediate: he must leave as soon as it becomes clear to him that this company deals in riba (usury or interest). However, I have a question in my mind about what you mean by the word "portfolio" in your question; I mean, does this company not deposit its money in a bank?
The questioner : The mixing of riba, where does it come from, Shaykh?
The Shaykh : No, I am not asking you about that.
The questioner : It does not deposit its funds.
The Shaykh : That is the answer. So where do they keep their money? This large amount of money, which amounts to millions, where is it kept?
The questioner : Let us say they kept it in the Kuwaiti Treasury... from Kuwait.
The Shaykh : Pardon me, I do not like to search in hypotheticals; I prefer reality; because you are asking a question to address a real situation!
The questioner : It is the reality.
The Shaykh : I want to... what happened?
The questioner : No, it is currently in the formation stage, and he wants to know whether he should proceed or withdraw?
The Shaykh : Okay, but the question will still remain standing!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And the answer is urgent: since this matter is not yet a reality but will happen, will it be a characteristic of its occurrence that this money, which amounts to millions, will be deposited in a bank or in another place? The planning must include this point first, as the first stage. And what I imagine today is that the group, especially if their wealth is extensive, cannot gather their money with a person they trust; they must transfer this money to the bank. And if that is the case, then the Levantine saying applies: "Call it unemployment."
The questioner : ... in the bank, this bank account does not have the capacity...
The Shaykh : My dear, I am saying this; now do not specify a bank for me. You are telling me whether this is kept with some of the partners or in the bank?
The questioner : It is kept in...
The Shaykh : A bank, you say?
The questioner : Yes, yes.
The Shaykh : You frightened me with this word [The Shaykh laughs!]
Another questioner : I heard your opinion on the matter of deferred sales, so we use the word "funds" according to our concept of banks.
The Shaykh : Good, that is fine. But when you deposit this money in the bank, and let us say as you said, we agree with you: in an Islamic bank, very well. What does the Islamic bank do with these vast millions of funds? What does it do with them? Do you know that it deals with them in a Sharia-compliant manner?
The questioner : ... it needs more detail, Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : First, regarding these funds, it depends on the people in charge of these funds, and the entry of this person, if Allah wills, will influence this direction?
The Shaykh : My brother, I have already answered you on this, and I will answer you with another phrase: "The end does not justify the means." We need to see if this work is based on a Sharia foundation or on a violation of the Shari'ah? If it is based on a violation of the Shari'ah, then your saying that he can change things over time does not justify him cooperating in evil!
The questioner : Yes, so the principle is to return to the foundation, the legal components of this.
The Shaykh : Of this company.
The questioner : And through this, the ruling is not... so consequently, if in your opinion, if the basic components of this portfolio have the possibility of entering into avenues?
The Shaykh : Distinction.
The questioner : So it means...
The Shaykh : Absolutely not, that never justifies it, never.
The questioner : May Allah reward you with good.
The Shaykh : And beware of that.
Another questioner: Peace be upon you.
The Shaykh: And upon you peace.
Another questioner : ... .
The Shaykh: Good.
The questioner : Should I stay in this company? Or do you think I should leave my responsibility in this portfolio? Through our discussion about what is lawful and what is forbidden, it became clear that with this man’s presence, he might be able to direct this portfolio, not entirely, but let us say, for example, forty-five million or forty million of the total portfolio amount, toward genuine investment avenues, away from the rest of the amount, which is invested in financial instruments that may include some riba (usury or interest) avenues. Is it obligatory for this person, who has this ability to influence this portfolio in this direction, to remain while some avenues remain in an investment where riba (usury or interest) is mixed in? Or should he purify himself and leave this company’s portfolio? Or should he stay and strive to correct the course of this portfolio?
The Shaykh : There is no doubt that the answer must be immediate: he must leave as soon as it becomes clear to him that this company deals in riba (usury or interest). However, I have a question in my mind about what you mean by the word "portfolio" in your question; I mean, does this company not deposit its money in a bank?
The questioner : The mixing of riba, where does it come from, Shaykh?
The Shaykh : No, I am not asking you about that.
The questioner : It does not deposit its funds.
The Shaykh : That is the answer. So where do they keep their money? This large amount of money, which amounts to millions, where is it kept?
The questioner : Let us say they kept it in the Kuwaiti Treasury... from Kuwait.
The Shaykh : Pardon me, I do not like to search in hypotheticals; I prefer reality; because you are asking a question to address a real situation!
The questioner : It is the reality.
The Shaykh : I want to... what happened?
The questioner : No, it is currently in the formation stage, and he wants to know whether he should proceed or withdraw?
The Shaykh : Okay, but the question will still remain standing!
The questioner: Yes.
The Shaykh : And the answer is urgent: since this matter is not yet a reality but will happen, will it be a characteristic of its occurrence that this money, which amounts to millions, will be deposited in a bank or in another place? The planning must include this point first, as the first stage. And what I imagine today is that the group, especially if their wealth is extensive, cannot gather their money with a person they trust; they must transfer this money to the bank. And if that is the case, then the Levantine saying applies: "Call it unemployment."
The questioner : ... in the bank, this bank account does not have the capacity...
The Shaykh : My dear, I am saying this; now do not specify a bank for me. You are telling me whether this is kept with some of the partners or in the bank?
The questioner : It is kept in...
The Shaykh : A bank, you say?
The questioner : Yes, yes.
The Shaykh : You frightened me with this word [The Shaykh laughs!]
Another questioner : I heard your opinion on the matter of deferred sales, so we use the word "funds" according to our concept of banks.
The Shaykh : Good, that is fine. But when you deposit this money in the bank, and let us say as you said, we agree with you: in an Islamic bank, very well. What does the Islamic bank do with these vast millions of funds? What does it do with them? Do you know that it deals with them in a Sharia-compliant manner?
The questioner : ... it needs more detail, Shaykh.
The Shaykh: Go ahead.
The questioner : First, regarding these funds, it depends on the people in charge of these funds, and the entry of this person, if Allah wills, will influence this direction?
The Shaykh : My brother, I have already answered you on this, and I will answer you with another phrase: "The end does not justify the means." We need to see if this work is based on a Sharia foundation or on a violation of the Shari'ah? If it is based on a violation of the Shari'ah, then your saying that he can change things over time does not justify him cooperating in evil!
The questioner : Yes, so the principle is to return to the foundation, the legal components of this.
The Shaykh : Of this company.
The questioner : And through this, the ruling is not... so consequently, if in your opinion, if the basic components of this portfolio have the possibility of entering into avenues?
The Shaykh : Distinction.
The questioner : So it means...
The Shaykh : Absolutely not, that never justifies it, never.
The questioner : May Allah reward you with good.
The Shaykh : And beware of that.
Another questioner: Peace be upon you.
The Shaykh: And upon you peace.
Another questioner : ... .
Source
www.al-albany.com
The Arabic text is copied verbatim from the original source, without any edits.