The Discussion on the Condition of the Existence of a Caliph for Jihad
Machine translationRead the Arabic original
The Shaykh : We agree that jihad is obligatory, but we differ on whether a caliph is required for it. We used to differ on whether an amir (prince) was required.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : So we agreed now. We differ on whether it is required that there be a caliph. You are asking why I brought this hadith. I brought it to prove to you what you deny, just as you denied previously that the existence of a caliph is a condition for jihad in the path of Allah. Therefore, I cited this hadith. You say to me, "What is its connection?" How can it have no connection? If the connection is not clear to you, be patient until it becomes clear to you, as you requested previously. It became clear to you that leadership is a condition for jihad, leadership in general, however you wish.
The student : I did not...
The Shaykh : Now, now, regarding the caliphate.
The student: All right, go ahead.
The Shaykh : Now, the discussion is about the caliphate.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : I am reminding you of the hadith. The hadith, in the end, says that the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him), advising Hudhayfah in the time of fitnah (trial, discord or temptation), and these are fitnahs that spread and overflowed, what should he do? He said:, before the one who knocks. I asked you about these descriptions, and I said that among them are "callers at the gates of Hell," which are realized in the present age, otherwise...
The student : ... .
The Shaykh : And I told you frankly, think, what is your answer? Are these descriptions applicable now, or do they need to come in the future?
The student : No, they are applicable, without doubt.
The Shaykh : Good, the last description, he said to him (peace and blessings be upon him): He said: Al-Mustadrak lil-Hakim 2:92 What should I do? He said: Now.
The student : Those sects.
The Shaykh : Be patient.
The student : No problem, we want...
The Shaykh : No problem, but be patient so I can finish my speech, may Allah be pleased with you, so I can finish my speech. Now I asked you questions related to this hadith. The last question: Do the Muslims have an imam and a jama'ah (congregation) of which he is the amir?
The student : The Muslims have a jama'ah, without doubt, of course, but they have many different imams.
The Shaykh : I am reminding you, what is the question?
The student : You said the Muslims have a jama'ah and an imam. I told you the Muslims have a jama'ah.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The student : But their imams are scattered.
The Shaykh : ... I am not asking you if they have an imam, and this imam is over the jama'ah as in the hadith. What do you understand from the hadith, my brother? When Hudhayfah says to him:Al-Mustadrak lil-Hakim 2:92 Does he mean imams or does he mean an imam?
The student : No, that is not possible.
The Shaykh : I am asking you, I am asking you.
The student : Perhaps I can clarify with a specific case from the Companions who lived in his time. The Companions, when their time came, they had a jama'ah, but they differed on the imam.
The Shaykh : This question is not permissible before finishing the answer to the previous question related to the authentic hadith.
The student : I told you... the answer, I told you, I told you, I said to you they have a jama'ah, but their scholars and imams are separated, they do not want to agree on this jama'ah, meaning if the scholars and imams, for example, wanted to agree, they would agree.
The Shaykh : O Allah, guide us among those You have guided.
The student : O Allah, amen.
The Shaykh : And what does this mean?
The student : It means...
The Shaykh : Listen to me a little.
The student : It means... of course, absolutely.
The Shaykh : Listen to me a little.
The student: Yes.
The Shaykh : Now, the Muslims, you say, although I, by Allah, feel that there is no need for this specific point I am about to ask you about, now, do the Muslims have a jama'ah or do they have jama'ahs (plural)?
The student : Jama'ahs, but not sects (firaq) in the sense that all of them are in the Fire except one, meaning there is a jama'ah.
The Shaykh : Who told you about the Fire and Paradise?
The student : No, I do not mean they are not sects.
The Shaykh : My dear, why do you bring things outside the subject of the discussion? From the beginning, I am telling you now, the hadith is explicit that it is a jama'ah.
The student: All right.
The Shaykh : And that it is what? One imam.
The student : But keeping away from the sects.
The Shaykh : One imam and one jama'ah, or imams and jama'ahs? What is the hadith talking about?
The student : ... Look, Professor.
The Shaykh : I am not answering.
The student : No, I must answer the answer that I see, I see that it must be correct.
The Shaykh : If Allah wills.
The student : And it is possible, for example, it is possible that the Muslims have more than one imam.
The Shaykh : Answer, brother, answer, but recall the question. The question: The Muslims have...
The student : I am recalling the question. It is possible that the Muslims have a jama'ah scattered among more than one imam.
The Shaykh : I am not asking you if it is possible, I am asking you about the reality.
The student : Good, the reality is like this.
The Shaykh : The reality now has imams.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : And jama'ahs, or an imam and a jama'ah?
The student : There are imams and there are jama'ahs.
The Shaykh: All right.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : Okay, it is established on this, one imam, there is none.
The student : There is none.
The Shaykh : One jama'ah, there is none, and what?
The student : If the intended meaning of jama'ah is, for example, one madhhab (school of jurisprudence), meaning in understanding the Book and the Sunnah...
The Shaykh : I am not talking about one madhhab.
The student : Then what?
The Shaykh : I am talking about a jama'ah and an imam, Professor. When the imams of the Muslims were there, there were more than four madhahibs, even the Mu'tazilah, but one imam and one jama'ah.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : ... In politics, we are not talking, we are talking about religion now, and the madhhab and madhahibs, we are talking about an imam and a jama'ah, an imam and a jama'ah. Now, is there an imam and a jama'ah or is there not?
The student : One imam and one jama'ah, there is not currently.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The student : There is none.
The Shaykh : What did the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) order Hudhayfah?
The student : He told him, keep away from those sects.
The Shaykh : Good, what do you do now?
The student : We want to see where the jama'ah of the Muslims is and try to make them have an imam.
The Shaykh : This... is what we are going around in circles about.
The student : Good, excellent.
The Shaykh : This is what we are going around in circles about, but where is the jihad? Jihad is not its time now. Establish the caliph whom the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) ordered you to adhere to and to adhere to his jama'ah. After that, jihad in the path of Allah will be a natural result.
The student : Where did you derive the condition of one caliph and one jama'ah from this hadith only?
The Shaykh : From this hadith.
The student : No, it does not mention jihad at all, not at all.
The Shaykh: Allahu Akbar.
The student : And jihad continues until the Day of Resurrection.
The Shaykh : Be patient a little, you want to speak now.
The student : No, do not... speak.
The Shaykh : No problem.
The student : Hmm.
The Shaykh : You.
The student : Meaning, how did we know that this hadith...
The Shaykh : I am speaking now.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : I am bringing you to your question. You have clarified to me now that the Muslims do not have one imam and one jama'ah.
The student: All right.
The Shaykh : But rather there are jama'ahs and imams, by your admission.
The student : No, in reality, it testifies to that.
The Shaykh : In reality, you support the reality, there is nothing.
The student : It is not a point, meaning, very big.
The Shaykh : No, very big and very much.
The student : Why?
The Shaykh : Because the hadith is saying, if the Muslims do not have one imam and one jama'ah, keep away from all those jama'ahs.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : So we agreed now. We differ on whether it is required that there be a caliph. You are asking why I brought this hadith. I brought it to prove to you what you deny, just as you denied previously that the existence of a caliph is a condition for jihad in the path of Allah. Therefore, I cited this hadith. You say to me, "What is its connection?" How can it have no connection? If the connection is not clear to you, be patient until it becomes clear to you, as you requested previously. It became clear to you that leadership is a condition for jihad, leadership in general, however you wish.
The student : I did not...
The Shaykh : Now, now, regarding the caliphate.
The student: All right, go ahead.
The Shaykh : Now, the discussion is about the caliphate.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : I am reminding you of the hadith. The hadith, in the end, says that the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him), advising Hudhayfah in the time of fitnah (trial, discord or temptation), and these are fitnahs that spread and overflowed, what should he do? He said:
So adhere to the imam of the Muslims and their jama'ah
فالزَمْ إمام المسلمين وجماعتهمThe student : ... .
The Shaykh : And I told you frankly, think, what is your answer? Are these descriptions applicable now, or do they need to come in the future?
The student : No, they are applicable, without doubt.
The Shaykh : Good, the last description, he said to him (peace and blessings be upon him):
Adhere to the imam of the Muslims and their jama'ah
الزم إمام المسلمين وجماعتهمIf they do not have an imam and a jama'ah?!
فإذا لم يكن لهم إمام وجماعة ؟!So keep away from all those jama'ahs
فاعتزل تلك الجماعات كلهاThe student : Those sects.
The Shaykh : Be patient.
The student : No problem, we want...
The Shaykh : No problem, but be patient so I can finish my speech, may Allah be pleased with you, so I can finish my speech. Now I asked you questions related to this hadith. The last question: Do the Muslims have an imam and a jama'ah (congregation) of which he is the amir?
The student : The Muslims have a jama'ah, without doubt, of course, but they have many different imams.
The Shaykh : I am reminding you, what is the question?
The student : You said the Muslims have a jama'ah and an imam. I told you the Muslims have a jama'ah.
The Shaykh : Yes.
The student : But their imams are scattered.
The Shaykh : ... I am not asking you if they have an imam, and this imam is over the jama'ah as in the hadith. What do you understand from the hadith, my brother? When Hudhayfah says to him:
And if they have no imam and no congregation?!
فإذا لم يكن لهم إمام ولا جماعة ؟!The student : No, that is not possible.
The Shaykh : I am asking you, I am asking you.
The student : Perhaps I can clarify with a specific case from the Companions who lived in his time. The Companions, when their time came, they had a jama'ah, but they differed on the imam.
The Shaykh : This question is not permissible before finishing the answer to the previous question related to the authentic hadith.
The student : I told you... the answer, I told you, I told you, I said to you they have a jama'ah, but their scholars and imams are separated, they do not want to agree on this jama'ah, meaning if the scholars and imams, for example, wanted to agree, they would agree.
The Shaykh : O Allah, guide us among those You have guided.
The student : O Allah, amen.
The Shaykh : And what does this mean?
The student : It means...
The Shaykh : Listen to me a little.
The student : It means... of course, absolutely.
The Shaykh : Listen to me a little.
The student: Yes.
The Shaykh : Now, the Muslims, you say, although I, by Allah, feel that there is no need for this specific point I am about to ask you about, now, do the Muslims have a jama'ah or do they have jama'ahs (plural)?
The student : Jama'ahs, but not sects (firaq) in the sense that all of them are in the Fire except one, meaning there is a jama'ah.
The Shaykh : Who told you about the Fire and Paradise?
The student : No, I do not mean they are not sects.
The Shaykh : My dear, why do you bring things outside the subject of the discussion? From the beginning, I am telling you now, the hadith is explicit that it is a jama'ah.
The student: All right.
The Shaykh : And that it is what? One imam.
The student : But keeping away from the sects.
The Shaykh : One imam and one jama'ah, or imams and jama'ahs? What is the hadith talking about?
The student : ... Look, Professor.
The Shaykh : I am not answering.
The student : No, I must answer the answer that I see, I see that it must be correct.
The Shaykh : If Allah wills.
The student : And it is possible, for example, it is possible that the Muslims have more than one imam.
The Shaykh : Answer, brother, answer, but recall the question. The question: The Muslims have...
The student : I am recalling the question. It is possible that the Muslims have a jama'ah scattered among more than one imam.
The Shaykh : I am not asking you if it is possible, I am asking you about the reality.
The student : Good, the reality is like this.
The Shaykh : The reality now has imams.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : And jama'ahs, or an imam and a jama'ah?
The student : There are imams and there are jama'ahs.
The Shaykh: All right.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : Okay, it is established on this, one imam, there is none.
The student : There is none.
The Shaykh : One jama'ah, there is none, and what?
The student : If the intended meaning of jama'ah is, for example, one madhhab (school of jurisprudence), meaning in understanding the Book and the Sunnah...
The Shaykh : I am not talking about one madhhab.
The student : Then what?
The Shaykh : I am talking about a jama'ah and an imam, Professor. When the imams of the Muslims were there, there were more than four madhahibs, even the Mu'tazilah, but one imam and one jama'ah.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : ... In politics, we are not talking, we are talking about religion now, and the madhhab and madhahibs, we are talking about an imam and a jama'ah, an imam and a jama'ah. Now, is there an imam and a jama'ah or is there not?
The student : One imam and one jama'ah, there is not currently.
The Shaykh: Yes.
The student : There is none.
The Shaykh : What did the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) order Hudhayfah?
The student : He told him, keep away from those sects.
The Shaykh : Good, what do you do now?
The student : We want to see where the jama'ah of the Muslims is and try to make them have an imam.
The Shaykh : This... is what we are going around in circles about.
The student : Good, excellent.
The Shaykh : This is what we are going around in circles about, but where is the jihad? Jihad is not its time now. Establish the caliph whom the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) ordered you to adhere to and to adhere to his jama'ah. After that, jihad in the path of Allah will be a natural result.
The student : Where did you derive the condition of one caliph and one jama'ah from this hadith only?
The Shaykh : From this hadith.
The student : No, it does not mention jihad at all, not at all.
The Shaykh: Allahu Akbar.
The student : And jihad continues until the Day of Resurrection.
The Shaykh : Be patient a little, you want to speak now.
The student : No, do not... speak.
The Shaykh : No problem.
The student : Hmm.
The Shaykh : You.
The student : Meaning, how did we know that this hadith...
The Shaykh : I am speaking now.
The student : Yes.
The Shaykh : I am bringing you to your question. You have clarified to me now that the Muslims do not have one imam and one jama'ah.
The student: All right.
The Shaykh : But rather there are jama'ahs and imams, by your admission.
The student : No, in reality, it testifies to that.
The Shaykh : In reality, you support the reality, there is nothing.
The student : It is not a point, meaning, very big.
The Shaykh : No, very big and very much.
The student : Why?
The Shaykh : Because the hadith is saying, if the Muslims do not have one imam and one jama'ah, keep away from all those jama'ahs.
Source
www.al-albany.com
The Arabic text is copied verbatim from the original source, without any edits.