Does removing the socks that were wiped over invalidate the ablution?
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The questioner : ... the time of 'Isha'
The Shaykh : Has the time entered?
The Shaykh : Do you hear the adhan?
The questioner : By Allah, sometimes...
The Shaykh : You are all in a state of wudu'...
The questioner : If he wiped over them and his wudu' did not become invalid, and he removed them, can he pray? The answer: Yes, based on the hadith of Ali.
The questioner : I mean the same situation: removing the socks while in a state of purity after having wiped over them, then putting the socks back on.
The Shaykh : It is the same...
The questioner : From the perspective of being cautious, is it not permissible to wipe?
The Shaykh : And that is the case. Yes, indeed.
The questioner : ...
The Shaykh : Because the intended meaning of purity is wudu'.
The questioner : Regarding the hadith of Ali, that he removed them without having broken his wudu' and without wiping, then put them on again, or something like that, I didn't understand?
The Shaykh : Are you currently narrating or seeking a fatwa?
The questioner : I am asking, yes... I used to think that Ali ibn Abi Talib (may Allah have mercy on him), or what I understood from what I read, was that Ali ibn Abi Talib (may Allah be pleased with him) put on the socks, wiped over them, removed them, and prayed. That is what I believed.
The Shaykh : How did Ali do it?
The questioner : His wudu' became invalid, and he wiped over them, removed them, and prayed.
The Shaykh : How did his wudu' become invalid and he wiped over them?
The questioner : I mean he performed wudu' and wiped over the socks or leather socks, and after wiping he removed them and prayed, and his wudu' did not become invalid. That is what I used to think. Now I have understood something else: that Ali ibn Abi Talib (may Allah have mercy on him), when he removed his sandals, meaning his leather socks, his wudu' had not yet become invalid after he put them on, and he did not wipe over them?
The Shaykh : The hadith of Ali, or the athar of Ali, is actually as follows: "He wiped over his sandals, not leather socks or socks, he wiped over his sandals, then he came to the mosque and removed them, and led the people in prayer as imam." This is the hadith, this is the athar, no more. So we do not say that he performed wudu' afterwards or that he did not perform wudu', because this is a narration. Why am I asking you whether you are seeking a fatwa or narrating? The athar from Ali is that he wiped over his sandals, then came to the mosque and removed them, and led the people in prayer as imam. So this athar indicates that removing the item that was wiped over does not invalidate the wudu', that is all.
The questioner : Now, the brother Asim asked, saying that a person wiped over socks and removed them?
The Shaykh : His wudu' did not become invalid, then he put them on or put on others, so it is not permissible for him to wipe over them, because he put them on while not in a state of purity.
The questioner : It is not permissible to wipe over them, but it is permissible for him to continue if he has not broken his wudu'.
The Shaykh : This is the hadith of Ali.
The questioner : I mean, based on this, the one who put them on while in a state of purity?
The Shaykh : Which one, the second time or the first time?
The questioner : The first time.
The Shaykh : The first time, he put them on while in complete wudu', good, then he wiped over them, then he removed them. So he may pray after removing them as long as he wishes until his wudu' becomes invalid. If his wudu' does not become invalid and he returns to them and puts them on or puts on others, he is not allowed to wipe over them. He prays until his wudu' becomes invalid. As for repeating the wiping over them, no, because...
The questioner : My teacher, a question: if a person performing 'Umrah performs 'Umrah three times within two weeks...
The Shaykh : From where does he perform 'Umrah?
The questioner : From al-Dhul-Hulaifah.
The Shaykh : If it is a special trip from the miqat, I see no obstacle to it, but he should not make that his habit.
The questioner : May Allah reward you with good.
The questioner : Shaykh, regarding the socks, some scholars, from the hadith of the socks, indicate that socks are among the customary items?
The Shaykh : Customary items! And can anyone tell us what is customary among socks?
The questioner : As they say, this thin nylon one did not exist in that era.
The Shaykh : And can they explain to us what existed in that era? And suppose that... what is beyond that, the sandals that exist today, did they exist in that time?
The questioner : Allah knows best.
The Shaykh : Allah knows best. If they say they did not exist, let him wear the old sandals and wipe over them, or the old leather socks. Since it is mentioned in the books of fiqh that some of the Salaf, among them 'Umar, according to al-Nawawi, held the permissibility of wiping over thin socks, what are the thin socks?
We are lenient with them, let them describe to us what the thick socks are? What leads them to this excessive strictness? And it is known that the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) used to say:Sunan Ibn Majah 2521Sahih (Darussalam) We do not have anything except that he wiped over the leather socks, but what are these leather socks, what is their shape, what are their characteristics? Neither the Shari'ah prescribed that for us, nor did the narrators transmit that to us. Also, he used to wipe over the socks and the sandals, and they did not transmit to us the characteristics of the socks or the sandals either.
This issue, I had discussed it with some people there. I used to say: I wonder about the socks he wiped over, if you are going to calculate this calculation, which is included in the generality of his saying (peace and blessings be upon him): We will respond to you in kind, how do the socks the Messenger wiped over enter into this?
The questioner : ...
The Shaykh : If he says no, this is not included in the relationship, and what is the second thing, how do you know that this has a connection and that one does not? And then you have a new philosophy, you say these socks were handmade and now they are machine-made, and if they were heavy, there is a consideration, also because the manufacturing has changed. This is intellectual rigidity, which some people fall into in some issues, those who escape from the apparent school, from the points of Ibn Hazm and his like. And this is what led them to distinguish between the handmade image and the photographic image, and a day may come when they distinguish between the handmade idol and the machine-made idol, because this idol was not carved.
The questioner : ...
The Shaykh : What does this group of scholars hold?
The questioner : But they discussed the issue that it is not permissible to wipe over thin socks.
The Shaykh : I know, what are the limits of thin socks?
The questioner : Yes, this is what we need to know.
The Shaykh : We are going to fall into confusion... everyone, greet him, my teacher?
The questioner : ... the greeting is one
The Shaykh : It is not you, this talk is for others, you go your own way... how are you, may you be well.
The questioner : Our Shaykh, some scholars use the command not to remove [the socks] within the specified period as evidence for the invalidation of wudu' by removing the socks or sandals. Is there evidence for this? ... Or is the condition of wiping that they remain?
The Shaykh : This is a strange understanding. Without doubt, the one who says this, without offense, regardless of whom you mean, this is not of fiqh at all, because we ask: is this command for obligation or what? What do you know about it?
The questioner : They cannot say it is for obligation.
The Shaykh : So what do they say? That is what is required.
The questioner : If they did not say
The Shaykh : And it is not for recommendation, this is for permissibility.
The questioner : No, recommendation is for the one who wants to wipe, meaning it is recommended for him to complete the period.
The Shaykh : Yes, indeed.
The student : ... encourages ... in contrast to treatment... specific or gives ... . Is there any harm in this?
The Shaykh : Welcome, and upon you be peace and the mercy of Allah and His blessings, welcome to everyone, you are welcome...
All praise is due to Allah, we praise Him, seek His help, and seek His forgiveness, and we seek refuge in Allah from the evils of our souls and from the badness of our deeds. Whom Allah guides, there is no one who can mislead him, and whom He misleads, there is no one who can guide him. And I bear witness that there is no god but Allah alone, with no partner, and I bear witness that Muhammad is His slave and His Messenger.
The Shaykh : Has the time entered?
The Shaykh : Do you hear the adhan?
The questioner : By Allah, sometimes...
The Shaykh : You are all in a state of wudu'...
The questioner : If he wiped over them and his wudu' did not become invalid, and he removed them, can he pray? The answer: Yes, based on the hadith of Ali.
The questioner : I mean the same situation: removing the socks while in a state of purity after having wiped over them, then putting the socks back on.
The Shaykh : It is the same...
The questioner : From the perspective of being cautious, is it not permissible to wipe?
The Shaykh : And that is the case. Yes, indeed.
The questioner : ...
The Shaykh : Because the intended meaning of purity is wudu'.
The questioner : Regarding the hadith of Ali, that he removed them without having broken his wudu' and without wiping, then put them on again, or something like that, I didn't understand?
The Shaykh : Are you currently narrating or seeking a fatwa?
The questioner : I am asking, yes... I used to think that Ali ibn Abi Talib (may Allah have mercy on him), or what I understood from what I read, was that Ali ibn Abi Talib (may Allah be pleased with him) put on the socks, wiped over them, removed them, and prayed. That is what I believed.
The Shaykh : How did Ali do it?
The questioner : His wudu' became invalid, and he wiped over them, removed them, and prayed.
The Shaykh : How did his wudu' become invalid and he wiped over them?
The questioner : I mean he performed wudu' and wiped over the socks or leather socks, and after wiping he removed them and prayed, and his wudu' did not become invalid. That is what I used to think. Now I have understood something else: that Ali ibn Abi Talib (may Allah have mercy on him), when he removed his sandals, meaning his leather socks, his wudu' had not yet become invalid after he put them on, and he did not wipe over them?
The Shaykh : The hadith of Ali, or the athar of Ali, is actually as follows: "He wiped over his sandals, not leather socks or socks, he wiped over his sandals, then he came to the mosque and removed them, and led the people in prayer as imam." This is the hadith, this is the athar, no more. So we do not say that he performed wudu' afterwards or that he did not perform wudu', because this is a narration. Why am I asking you whether you are seeking a fatwa or narrating? The athar from Ali is that he wiped over his sandals, then came to the mosque and removed them, and led the people in prayer as imam. So this athar indicates that removing the item that was wiped over does not invalidate the wudu', that is all.
The questioner : Now, the brother Asim asked, saying that a person wiped over socks and removed them?
The Shaykh : His wudu' did not become invalid, then he put them on or put on others, so it is not permissible for him to wipe over them, because he put them on while not in a state of purity.
The questioner : It is not permissible to wipe over them, but it is permissible for him to continue if he has not broken his wudu'.
The Shaykh : This is the hadith of Ali.
The questioner : I mean, based on this, the one who put them on while in a state of purity?
The Shaykh : Which one, the second time or the first time?
The questioner : The first time.
The Shaykh : The first time, he put them on while in complete wudu', good, then he wiped over them, then he removed them. So he may pray after removing them as long as he wishes until his wudu' becomes invalid. If his wudu' does not become invalid and he returns to them and puts them on or puts on others, he is not allowed to wipe over them. He prays until his wudu' becomes invalid. As for repeating the wiping over them, no, because...
The questioner : My teacher, a question: if a person performing 'Umrah performs 'Umrah three times within two weeks...
The Shaykh : From where does he perform 'Umrah?
The questioner : From al-Dhul-Hulaifah.
The Shaykh : If it is a special trip from the miqat, I see no obstacle to it, but he should not make that his habit.
The questioner : May Allah reward you with good.
The questioner : Shaykh, regarding the socks, some scholars, from the hadith of the socks, indicate that socks are among the customary items?
The Shaykh : Customary items! And can anyone tell us what is customary among socks?
The questioner : As they say, this thin nylon one did not exist in that era.
The Shaykh : And can they explain to us what existed in that era? And suppose that... what is beyond that, the sandals that exist today, did they exist in that time?
The questioner : Allah knows best.
The Shaykh : Allah knows best. If they say they did not exist, let him wear the old sandals and wipe over them, or the old leather socks. Since it is mentioned in the books of fiqh that some of the Salaf, among them 'Umar, according to al-Nawawi, held the permissibility of wiping over thin socks, what are the thin socks?
We are lenient with them, let them describe to us what the thick socks are? What leads them to this excessive strictness? And it is known that the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) used to say:
Every conditions that is not in the Book of Allah (SWT) is invalid, even if there are one hundred conditions
كل شرط ليس في كتاب الله فهو باطل ولو كان مئة شرطThis issue, I had discussed it with some people there. I used to say: I wonder about the socks he wiped over, if you are going to calculate this calculation, which is included in the generality of his saying (peace and blessings be upon him):
The extremists are destroyed, the extremists are destroyed, the extremists are destroyed
هلك المتنطعون , هلك المتنطعون , هلك المتنطعونThe questioner : ...
The Shaykh : If he says no, this is not included in the relationship, and what is the second thing, how do you know that this has a connection and that one does not? And then you have a new philosophy, you say these socks were handmade and now they are machine-made, and if they were heavy, there is a consideration, also because the manufacturing has changed. This is intellectual rigidity, which some people fall into in some issues, those who escape from the apparent school, from the points of Ibn Hazm and his like. And this is what led them to distinguish between the handmade image and the photographic image, and a day may come when they distinguish between the handmade idol and the machine-made idol, because this idol was not carved.
The questioner : ...
The Shaykh : What does this group of scholars hold?
The questioner : But they discussed the issue that it is not permissible to wipe over thin socks.
The Shaykh : I know, what are the limits of thin socks?
The questioner : Yes, this is what we need to know.
The Shaykh : We are going to fall into confusion... everyone, greet him, my teacher?
The questioner : ... the greeting is one
The Shaykh : It is not you, this talk is for others, you go your own way... how are you, may you be well.
The questioner : Our Shaykh, some scholars use the command not to remove [the socks] within the specified period as evidence for the invalidation of wudu' by removing the socks or sandals. Is there evidence for this? ... Or is the condition of wiping that they remain?
The Shaykh : This is a strange understanding. Without doubt, the one who says this, without offense, regardless of whom you mean, this is not of fiqh at all, because we ask: is this command for obligation or what? What do you know about it?
The questioner : They cannot say it is for obligation.
The Shaykh : So what do they say? That is what is required.
The questioner : If they did not say
The Shaykh : And it is not for recommendation, this is for permissibility.
The questioner : No, recommendation is for the one who wants to wipe, meaning it is recommended for him to complete the period.
The Shaykh : Yes, indeed.
The student : ... encourages ... in contrast to treatment... specific or gives ... . Is there any harm in this?
The Shaykh : Welcome, and upon you be peace and the mercy of Allah and His blessings, welcome to everyone, you are welcome...
All praise is due to Allah, we praise Him, seek His help, and seek His forgiveness, and we seek refuge in Allah from the evils of our souls and from the badness of our deeds. Whom Allah guides, there is no one who can mislead him, and whom He misleads, there is no one who can guide him. And I bear witness that there is no god but Allah alone, with no partner, and I bear witness that Muhammad is His slave and His Messenger.
Source
www.al-albany.com
The Arabic text is copied verbatim from the original source, without any edits.