Is it established from Ibn al-Qayyim the statement regarding the annihilation of the Fire, and from Shaykh al-Islam?
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The student: ... Ibn al-Qayyim's statement regarding the annihilation of the Fire
The Shaykh : Ibn al-Qayyim (may Allah have mercy on him), his words in *Miftah Dar al-Sa'adah* and *Shifa' al-'Alil* give the impression that he prefers that view, because he mentioned the two opinions and the evidence. He (may Allah have mercy on him), when he speaks, is thorough and takes his time, so his words in these two books give the impression that he leans toward that. However, he has other words in *al-Wabil al-Sayyib* that indicate he sees that the Fire is two fires: the Fire of the disbelievers, which does not perish, because they are eternal in it forever, and the Fire of the sinners, who are punished according to their sins and then come out, which perishes, because its people, what? They came out of it, and if they came out of it, there is no benefit in its remaining. This division, from the rational perspective, is a strong division, meaning a person leans toward it from the rational perspective. However, the consideration may remain that one might say: What is the evidence that there are two fires? This requires evidence. And what appears from the evidence is that the Fire is one, and that the sinners are punished with the Fire with which the disbelievers are punished. But rationally, his (may Allah have mercy on him) detailed statement is good, even if one were to say: Also, reason indicates that the Fire must be two fires, because it is not possible for the believing open sinner to be punished with a Fire of intense heat, where every time his skin is cooked, another skin is replaced for him, as is the case with the Fire of the disbelievers. From the rational perspective, reason fully agrees. If it is correct, it is from Allah, and if it is an error, Allah forgives it. Yes.
The student: May Allah reward you, O Shaykh, and what is ... attributed to Shaykh al-Islam
The Shaykh : By Allah, I have not come across any statement of his on that matter, ... As for me, I have not looked into anything on that matter. But, O our brothers, it is not permissible, ever, to know the truth by men. It is obligatory to know the truth by evidence. As long as the words of Allah (Mighty and Majestic) are before us, how do we think to prefer one opinion or say so-and-so said this or so-and-so said that? If the greatest of people, other than the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him), said it, we would say: No hearing and no obeying, no belief and no faith. The words of Allah (Mighty and Majestic) are before us, and He is the Creator (Mighty and Majestic) and the Knower of all things.
The Shaykh : Ibn al-Qayyim (may Allah have mercy on him), his words in *Miftah Dar al-Sa'adah* and *Shifa' al-'Alil* give the impression that he prefers that view, because he mentioned the two opinions and the evidence. He (may Allah have mercy on him), when he speaks, is thorough and takes his time, so his words in these two books give the impression that he leans toward that. However, he has other words in *al-Wabil al-Sayyib* that indicate he sees that the Fire is two fires: the Fire of the disbelievers, which does not perish, because they are eternal in it forever, and the Fire of the sinners, who are punished according to their sins and then come out, which perishes, because its people, what? They came out of it, and if they came out of it, there is no benefit in its remaining. This division, from the rational perspective, is a strong division, meaning a person leans toward it from the rational perspective. However, the consideration may remain that one might say: What is the evidence that there are two fires? This requires evidence. And what appears from the evidence is that the Fire is one, and that the sinners are punished with the Fire with which the disbelievers are punished. But rationally, his (may Allah have mercy on him) detailed statement is good, even if one were to say: Also, reason indicates that the Fire must be two fires, because it is not possible for the believing open sinner to be punished with a Fire of intense heat, where every time his skin is cooked, another skin is replaced for him, as is the case with the Fire of the disbelievers. From the rational perspective, reason fully agrees. If it is correct, it is from Allah, and if it is an error, Allah forgives it. Yes.
The student: May Allah reward you, O Shaykh, and what is ... attributed to Shaykh al-Islam
The Shaykh : By Allah, I have not come across any statement of his on that matter, ... As for me, I have not looked into anything on that matter. But, O our brothers, it is not permissible, ever, to know the truth by men. It is obligatory to know the truth by evidence. As long as the words of Allah (Mighty and Majestic) are before us, how do we think to prefer one opinion or say so-and-so said this or so-and-so said that? If the greatest of people, other than the Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him), said it, we would say: No hearing and no obeying, no belief and no faith. The words of Allah (Mighty and Majestic) are before us, and He is the Creator (Mighty and Majestic) and the Knower of all things.