Is the weakening by Imam Ahmad of some narrators who held the view that the Qur'an is created a matter of warning rather than precision? And a response to al-Saqaf and his methodology
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Abu Malik: ... So is his statement intended only as a warning? When he weakens one of those who say the Qur'an is created?
The Shaykh : Excuse me, so what are you trying to say? Because I went ... into something else
Abu Malik: I am saying that Imam Ahmad mentions that Imam Ahmad
The Shaykh : Yes, yes, but what do you want to add to it, exactly?
Abu Malik: I want to say, is this truly Imam Ahmad's opinion on this specific issue? On weakening and authenticating?
The Shaykh : I do not see what you mean. Mention what is being corrected?
Abu Malik: I mean, he says that Imam Ahmad's weakening of some narrators who said the Qur'an is created is not a rejection of the hadith, nor a rejection of the narration, but only a warning.
The Shaykh : Now the intent of your statement is clear
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly
The Shaykh : Of course not. He weakens, so he signs off on Imam Ahmad's statement ... it aligns with his own viewpoint
Abu Malik: His own viewpoint? This is strange and astonishing. This is a deviation in religion, this, O Shaykh
The Shaykh : Yes, here is the problem
Abu Malik: Truly ... .
The Shaykh : He can say that Ahmad's opinion is such, but the opinion of others is such, and I am with those others
Abu Malik: That is it
The Shaykh : As for interpreting the words of the ... , he has many instances where he does this.
Abu Malik: I seek refuge in Allah
The Shaykh : For example, for example, from what you have heard, he mentions regarding Ibn 'Adi or al-'Uqayli that he says, regarding Ibn 'Adi, I just remembered, he says about 'Abd al-Razzaq, the author of the Musannaf, that he is truthful (siddiq). He says, it is not possible that 'Abd al-Razzaq, an imam and author, etc., is not possible. Ibn 'Adi says only that he is truthful. So he imagines Ibn 'Adi as if he lived in his time and gathered all the opinions from here and there from the imams and the memorizers, then formed an opinion from the sum of the opinions. Whereas Ibn 'Adi is an imam, meaning he gives his own opinion without relying on the efforts of others, as we do. So he reached the point where he says about 'Abd al-Razzaq that he is truthful.
Abu Malik: This is a quality by which he praises him, and
The Shaykh : And so he keeps interpreting his words with an interpretation that makes a person doubt whether to accept the words of the imams
Abu Malik: He has ruined it
The Shaykh : Yes, that is right.
Abu Malik: It is a strange thing
The Shaykh : This was the man's opinion
The questioner : ... This person is accused of ... f ... he may speak about the people of the Sunnah and hadith, or he may speak about the ... with individuals when he says about those who do not ... as in ... .
The Shaykh : That he is truthful, even though they are trustworthy (thiqat). You have qualities for him, but for him, he is only truthful.
The questioner : Or ... in the discussion of narrators described as ... .
The Shaykh : He does not hear the question
The questioner : I am present in ... .
The Shaykh : Huh, now you are hearing the answer, but you do not benefit from it because you did not hear the question.
Another questioner: ...
Another questioner: ... the book of Sahih, meaning this
The Shaykh : More than fiqh
The questioner : Yes, that is right.
Another questioner: And on the first part of ... .
The questioner : But the cause of the rejection is the weakening
Abu Malik: Other than the Companions
The Shaykh : His statement would only be correct if it were from 'Ali ibn al-Madini that this man has a hadith about the 'Id prayer, and he explicitly stated his ignorance (of the narrator), and yet he said this hadith is authentic. Then his statement would be sound. But what is he doing? He is fabricating: So-and-so said about him, this is unknown, and so-and-so said about him, unknown, but 'Ali ibn al-Madini authenticated the hadith. So 'Ali ibn al-Madini authenticates the hadiths of unknown narrators. This is fabrication. This is it.
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly
The Shaykh : This is a problem, Glory be to Allah
Abu Malik: ... This is a calamity. It is forbidden for this man to take the lead in teaching this knowledge. It is forbidden. This is a disaster, by Allah
The Shaykh : Then he comes and says to the attendees, and there is not one among them who is ignorant of hadith like him or more than him. He says, before anything else, look at the text (matn), not the chain (sanad)
Abu Malik: His authentication and weakening are based on the chain. There is no power or strength except in Allah ... How can the chain be sound? "And how can the shadow be straight when the stick is crooked?" In truth, the chain is the stick. The stick.
Another questioner: ...
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly
The Shaykh :"If it were not for the chain, whoever wished would say whatever he wished"
Abu Malik: The chain is the religion
Another questioner: Of the religion, yes
Abu Malik: By Allah, it is forbidden. This is forbidden
The questioner : ... al-Tirmidhi ... authenticated
Abu Malik: I seek refuge in Allah
The questioner : ... before al-Bukhari ... the Sahih ... .
Another questioner: Even in al-Bukhari too
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh : The problem of fabrication here is like the fabrication in fiqh. He brings in delusions
The questioner : There is humiliation, and yet
The Shaykh : No fabrication, fabrication
The questioner : ... narrator, the narrator of the hadith, the narrator from Jabir
The Shaykh : Why did he say that? He said it because he looked at the chain and found it objectionable, even though it is the habit of Ibn Khuzaymah in his Sahih to say, "I am free from the responsibility of this narrator because I do not know his integrity." So he rejects the hadith due to the narrator's ignorance. What does he do? He says, this is 'Abdullah. Why did he reject the hadith? Because he looked at the text.
Abu Malik: I seek refuge in Allah.
The Shaykh : Well, if we said to him, what do you think if, for example, a narrator is authenticated but has weakness in his memory, and his hadith is good (hasan), would he reject it on the basis of the text? He might say yes. Has the trustworthy, precise memorizer transitioned? Would he reject his hadith on the basis of the text? Meaning, a man who is lax ... .
Abu Malik: Yes, by Allah
The Shaykh : And the calamity is that he is giving lessons. He is giving lessons.
Abu Malik: Yes, and people are pleased with him. And I think, O our Shaykh, that this is also ... being promoted through some of the shaykhs, so that it is said that he has appeared
The Shaykh : We have, meaning, scholars in hadith.
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly
The Shaykh : Scholars ... .
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly. This means he is pointed to, and perhaps he guides the youth in the right direction.
The Shaykh : Excuse me, so what are you trying to say? Because I went ... into something else
Abu Malik: I am saying that Imam Ahmad mentions that Imam Ahmad
The Shaykh : Yes, yes, but what do you want to add to it, exactly?
Abu Malik: I want to say, is this truly Imam Ahmad's opinion on this specific issue? On weakening and authenticating?
The Shaykh : I do not see what you mean. Mention what is being corrected?
Abu Malik: I mean, he says that Imam Ahmad's weakening of some narrators who said the Qur'an is created is not a rejection of the hadith, nor a rejection of the narration, but only a warning.
The Shaykh : Now the intent of your statement is clear
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly
The Shaykh : Of course not. He weakens, so he signs off on Imam Ahmad's statement ... it aligns with his own viewpoint
Abu Malik: His own viewpoint? This is strange and astonishing. This is a deviation in religion, this, O Shaykh
The Shaykh : Yes, here is the problem
Abu Malik: Truly ... .
The Shaykh : He can say that Ahmad's opinion is such, but the opinion of others is such, and I am with those others
Abu Malik: That is it
The Shaykh : As for interpreting the words of the ... , he has many instances where he does this.
Abu Malik: I seek refuge in Allah
The Shaykh : For example, for example, from what you have heard, he mentions regarding Ibn 'Adi or al-'Uqayli that he says, regarding Ibn 'Adi, I just remembered, he says about 'Abd al-Razzaq, the author of the Musannaf, that he is truthful (siddiq). He says, it is not possible that 'Abd al-Razzaq, an imam and author, etc., is not possible. Ibn 'Adi says only that he is truthful. So he imagines Ibn 'Adi as if he lived in his time and gathered all the opinions from here and there from the imams and the memorizers, then formed an opinion from the sum of the opinions. Whereas Ibn 'Adi is an imam, meaning he gives his own opinion without relying on the efforts of others, as we do. So he reached the point where he says about 'Abd al-Razzaq that he is truthful.
Abu Malik: This is a quality by which he praises him, and
The Shaykh : And so he keeps interpreting his words with an interpretation that makes a person doubt whether to accept the words of the imams
Abu Malik: He has ruined it
The Shaykh : Yes, that is right.
Abu Malik: It is a strange thing
The Shaykh : This was the man's opinion
The questioner : ... This person is accused of ... f ... he may speak about the people of the Sunnah and hadith, or he may speak about the ... with individuals when he says about those who do not ... as in ... .
The Shaykh : That he is truthful, even though they are trustworthy (thiqat). You have qualities for him, but for him, he is only truthful.
The questioner : Or ... in the discussion of narrators described as ... .
The Shaykh : He does not hear the question
The questioner : I am present in ... .
The Shaykh : Huh, now you are hearing the answer, but you do not benefit from it because you did not hear the question.
Another questioner: ...
Another questioner: ... the book of Sahih, meaning this
The Shaykh : More than fiqh
The questioner : Yes, that is right.
Another questioner: And on the first part of ... .
The questioner : But the cause of the rejection is the weakening
Abu Malik: Other than the Companions
The Shaykh : His statement would only be correct if it were from 'Ali ibn al-Madini that this man has a hadith about the 'Id prayer, and he explicitly stated his ignorance (of the narrator), and yet he said this hadith is authentic. Then his statement would be sound. But what is he doing? He is fabricating: So-and-so said about him, this is unknown, and so-and-so said about him, unknown, but 'Ali ibn al-Madini authenticated the hadith. So 'Ali ibn al-Madini authenticates the hadiths of unknown narrators. This is fabrication. This is it.
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly
The Shaykh : This is a problem, Glory be to Allah
Abu Malik: ... This is a calamity. It is forbidden for this man to take the lead in teaching this knowledge. It is forbidden. This is a disaster, by Allah
The Shaykh : Then he comes and says to the attendees, and there is not one among them who is ignorant of hadith like him or more than him. He says, before anything else, look at the text (matn), not the chain (sanad)
Abu Malik: His authentication and weakening are based on the chain. There is no power or strength except in Allah ... How can the chain be sound? "And how can the shadow be straight when the stick is crooked?" In truth, the chain is the stick. The stick.
Another questioner: ...
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly
The Shaykh :"If it were not for the chain, whoever wished would say whatever he wished"
Abu Malik: The chain is the religion
Another questioner: Of the religion, yes
Abu Malik: By Allah, it is forbidden. This is forbidden
The questioner : ... al-Tirmidhi ... authenticated
Abu Malik: I seek refuge in Allah
The questioner : ... before al-Bukhari ... the Sahih ... .
Another questioner: Even in al-Bukhari too
The questioner : ... .
The Shaykh : The problem of fabrication here is like the fabrication in fiqh. He brings in delusions
The questioner : There is humiliation, and yet
The Shaykh : No fabrication, fabrication
The questioner : ... narrator, the narrator of the hadith, the narrator from Jabir
The Shaykh : Why did he say that? He said it because he looked at the chain and found it objectionable, even though it is the habit of Ibn Khuzaymah in his Sahih to say, "I am free from the responsibility of this narrator because I do not know his integrity." So he rejects the hadith due to the narrator's ignorance. What does he do? He says, this is 'Abdullah. Why did he reject the hadith? Because he looked at the text.
Abu Malik: I seek refuge in Allah.
The Shaykh : Well, if we said to him, what do you think if, for example, a narrator is authenticated but has weakness in his memory, and his hadith is good (hasan), would he reject it on the basis of the text? He might say yes. Has the trustworthy, precise memorizer transitioned? Would he reject his hadith on the basis of the text? Meaning, a man who is lax ... .
Abu Malik: Yes, by Allah
The Shaykh : And the calamity is that he is giving lessons. He is giving lessons.
Abu Malik: Yes, and people are pleased with him. And I think, O our Shaykh, that this is also ... being promoted through some of the shaykhs, so that it is said that he has appeared
The Shaykh : We have, meaning, scholars in hadith.
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly
The Shaykh : Scholars ... .
Abu Malik: Yes, exactly. This means he is pointed to, and perhaps he guides the youth in the right direction.