Discussion on the ruling of declaring ignorant Muslims who invoke the people of the graves to be disbelievers?

The Shaykh: "The Shaykh's donkey stopped at the obstacle" a condition to see "and you will know and you will see when the dust settles" " " Is it a horse under you or a donkey? "A condition to see.
The student: Standing up for the one who arrives.

The Shaykh: Standing up for the one who arrives.
The student: Standing up for the one who arrives.

The Shaykh: And to the...
The student: To the one who arrives, excuse me.

The Shaykh: No, let it remain on the first one, it is more correct, otherwise you will increase in error and plunge deeper into error.
The student: You will stand up for the one who arrives, and we have known the text of the hadith.

The Shaykh: And to the one who arrives. Okay, so did I agree or did I disagree?
The student: I agreed.

The Shaykh: So then, hehehe.
The student: O Shaykh, regarding the graves... is that not so? The graveyards.

The Shaykh: You are pointing here, here, there are no graves, the graves you passed by there, yes.
The student : ... .

The Shaykh: But most people do not know. I have informed you and spared you the answer, but most people do not know.
The student : ... .

The Shaykh: Yes, because you did not leave your village to know what exists in other countries.
The student: Our Shaykh, is this a graveyard or nothing from the graveyards.

The Shaykh: He does not see anything, the poor man does not see anything, now if you go to Egypt and go to the Mosque of al-Husayn and Sayyidah Zaynab and look at the ones circumambulating around the graves.
The student: Okay... the ones circumambulating, the question: is the word disbelief applied to them?

The Shaykh: No.
The student : ... .

The Shaykh: Yes.
The student: And circumambulation is worship.

The Shaykh: And does every one who circumambulates around a grave, or in a broader and more comprehensive phrase, does every one who fell into disbelief, does disbelief fall upon him?
The student: No.

The Shaykh: You have spared us the burden of the response.
The student: But it is required of us that...

The Shaykh: What, but this is a correction.
The student: Without a correction.

The Shaykh : Yes.
The student: Is it required of us that we ask...

The Shaykh: And what is the fruit of the question or not asking? What is the fruit of the question or not asking?
The student: The fruit of the question, if we say we do not declare someone a disbeliever until we establish the proof upon him.

The Shaykh: And not asking.
The student: Not asking... we have the apparent ruling in the status of disbelief.

The Shaykh: In the status of disbelief, this is a diplomatic phrase, what does it mean, in the status of disbelief, does it mean he is not a disbeliever?
The student: It means he is a disbeliever.

The Shaykh: A disbeliever, meaning you have broken what you agreed with me on just now.
The student: But with us is the apparent ruling...

The Shaykh: Okay, there are two contradictory appearances, a man prays to Allah and prays to the grave, so which of the two appearances do you give precedence over the other?
The student: A man prays to Allah.

The Shaykh: Yes.
The student: A man prays.

The Shaykh: He is the same one who prays to the grave, which of the two appearances do you adopt regarding this person?
The student: He prays to the grave, to the grave.

The Shaykh: Which of the two appearances do you give precedence over the other and rule by it regarding the man?
The student : The second one.

The Shaykh: Why not the first one?
The student: His appearance is that he faces the grave.

The Shaykh: His appearance is that he prays to Allah and fasts for Allah and performs Hajj for Allah and says there is no god but Allah.
The student: But he has broken it.

The Shaykh: There is no power or strength.
The student : ... .

The Shaykh: No, we agreed that he is not a breaker with certainty, therefore I said in some of what I said, you want to establish the proof upon him, therefore you ask him, did you forget this speech?
The student: No.

The Shaykh: But you have forgotten it, so.
The student: I have something in my mind, O Shaykh, is it required.

The Shaykh: You are not the first person the moon has deceived, what is in your mind?
The student: In my mind, is it required to establish the proof or to understand the proof?

The Shaykh: Is it required to establish the proof or.
The student: To understand the proof?

The Shaykh: To understand the proof.
The student: The proof may have been established upon him.

The Shaykh: I know your question and what knowledge is behind it, but I know that it is wrong, you want to say: if we establish the proof upon him, has the proof been established upon him whether he understood it or not, this is what you want.
The student: Yes.

The Shaykh: I saw, then you, from the completeness of what you want, you want to say: that even if he did not understand, the proof has been established upon him, is that not so? All of this is error in error, and I do not say misguidance in misguidance. Have you seen, if you recited a verse or verses from the Book of Allah to a non-Arab man who knows nothing of Arabic, has the proof been established upon him? Hey, look, his brother has a long story, I am amazed at his silence and quietness for the clarity of the speech, he said: No, while you are silent, a substitute for his long silence, why do you not say like your brother said.
The student: By the verses, by the recitation.

The Shaykh: Why do you not say like your brother said.
The student: I say no.

The Shaykh: Or why do you not say the opposite of what your brother said?
The student: I say no, but there is also...

The Shaykh: Regarding what?
The student: Regarding this answer.

The Shaykh : Why?
The student: Because if you recite the Qur'an upon him or he knows nothing of Arabic... it is not required that the proof be established upon him by reciting the verses, because the proof has been established by his hearing of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) or of Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him).

The Shaykh: ... between us, you have strayed a lot from us, O Shaykh, how does he understand Muhammad, how does he understand his call, he is a non-Arab, what do you have?
The student: Has he not heard of Islam?

The Shaykh: What is Islam? Do you not know that Islam has concepts by the dozens, say.
The student: Yes.

The Shaykh: Which Islam do you mean from these Islams?
The student: The purified Islam.

The Shaykh: From where does he understand this purified Islam? The Arabs, you Arabs, are still differing in the most extreme difference in understanding the purified Islam, so what do you say about the non-Arabs like me, therefore be slow and beware that you do not let loose the reins of declaring Muslims disbelievers. If you were a ruler and you saw one of these non-Arabs circumambulating around the graves and prostrating to the Shaykh... perhaps you would kill him? Say it clearly.
The student: If he was in the lands of the Muslims, yes, if you were a ruler.

The Shaykh: For example, the lands of Islam, Turkey? The lands of Islam.
The student: Yes.

The Shaykh: These people did not understand Islam, do you kill him? Yes, O Allah, guide my people, for they do not know. - Give me some water, do you have any? -