Continuation of the explanation of the saying of Allah the Exalted: “Those who consume usury will not stand except as the one stands whom Satan has struck with madness. That is because they said, ‘Trade is just like usury.’ But Allah has permitted trade and forbidden usury. So whoever is given a warning from his Lord and stops, what he has previously done is his, and his case is up to Allah. But whoever returns to it, those are the companions of the Fire; they will abide therein forever. Allah destroys usury and grows the charities.”

The Shaykh : Then he stopped at His saying and said, “He grows it,” meaning He increases it and adds to it. It is established from the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him and his family) that he said, or meaning his young foal until it becomes like a mountain. And He the Exalted said, So charities are excellence and worship of Allah. When a person gives charity from his wealth, Allah the Exalted multiplies for him the reward and the merit of this charity, and He sends down blessing upon what remains of his wealth. As it is authentic from the Prophet (may the prayer and peace of Allah be upon him) that he said, Allah mentioned charities alongside usury because usury is injustice, oppression, and consuming wealth unlawfully, while charities are excellence and good. He compared this to that so that the difference between the doers of good and the oppressors who consume usury becomes clear to the person.
Then He said, encouraging faith and righteous deeds. Then He the Mighty and Majestic said, “Fear Allah,” commanding the fear of Allah. Then He said, “Leave what remains of usury,” meaning leave it and do not take it. He specified after generalizing because the fear of Allah encompasses avoiding every forbidden thing and performing every obligatory thing. So when He said, it became a specification after a generalization. meaning and you leave what remains of usury. In a reading, the meaning is you declare war against Allah and His Messenger. We ask Allah for safety. If you repent from usury, then for you are your principal. You gave a hundred for a hundred and twenty; if you are sincere in your repentance, you take only the hundred. Because Allah says, Some people have been tested by defective analogy against the text. They say, “If I deposit my money in foreign banks in America, in England, in France, in any country, I take usury, I take usury and give it in charity.” Glory be to Allah! The person smears his hand with blood and impurity, then goes to wash it. Why does he not avoid the impurity from the start? This is defective analogy against the text, and it is also defective in its consideration. If they offer it to you, say, “Our religion forbids us usury.”
Some people say, “If you do not take it from them, they will spend it in churches and in war against the Muslims.” We say, who said this? The owner of the bank might take it for himself, take it for his relatives, or take it for his own interests. Who says it is spent in churches? And even if it were spent in churches, did it enter your ownership such that it could be said you aided them? It did not enter your ownership at all. For this reason, they do not give you the profit of your wealth. Perhaps they mix your wealth with their wealth and it is lost. Rather, they give you clear, defined usury from the start. So it is not the profit of your wealth such that you would say, “I gave them something of my wealth to help them with the forbidden.” Never. And even if it were the profit of your wealth, or if your wealth profited more, and you refused to take it because it is usury, and they spent it in churches and in war against the Muslims, did you order them to do this? Never. You, fear Allah. You have your principal. Do not oppress and do not be oppressed. As for taking it and saying, “I want to give it in charity,” this is like a person who took excrement in his hand and squeezed it, then said, “Where is the water so I can purify my hand?” This is not correct.
Then we say, who guarantees that if a million or two million in usury comes to you, that you will give it in charity? Perhaps greed will overcome you, and you will say, “By Allah, this is two million; I will give it in charity. No, let it be. We will wait and see.” Then it turns around you, and the days pass, and you die, and you leave it for others.
Then if you do that, you become an example for people. They say, “So-and-so put his income in the bank and took usury, so there is no harm.” So you become an example. Then if we become accustomed to this thing and take usury, it means we will not try to establish an Islamic bank. Because establishing an Islamic bank is not easy; it is difficult, and there are obstacles, and people prevent Muslims from it. So if people become accustomed to this, it becomes easy for them to say, “We will take usury, and it is easy, until Allah provides an Islamic bank.” But if it is said to him, “This is forbidden for you,” then at that time the Muslims are compelled to establish Islamic banks that suffice them, instead of these usurious banks.
The conclusion is that whoever says, “Take usury and give it in charity,” has opposed the text with analogy. And Allah the Mighty and Majestic clarified, And if the usury contract that occurred in the pre-Islamic age of ignorance in the time of the Messenger (may the prayer and peace of Allah be upon him) was established by the Messenger, even though it was before the Shari'ah and the people of the pre-Islamic age of ignorance practiced it as permissible, and yet the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) established it, saying, how much more so for a Muslim who knows that usury is forbidden and says, “I will take it and give it in charity”?
So the conclusion is that, unfortunately, this has been confused for some scholars who are pointed to with fingers. They thought there is no harm in taking this and giving it in charity. If they had looked carefully and thought, they would have known that they are mistaken. What is our argument with Allah on the Day of Resurrection? Do not oppress and do not be oppressed.” The truth is that we regret that some who are pointed to issue fatwas like this, even though if they looked deeply and carefully, they would find that they are in error. I agree with you. My Lord said to me, “You have your principal. Do not oppress and do not be oppressed.” I say, “Hear and obey, O my Lord.” I take my principal, and the rest is not my concern. Let them put it in what they want. Then, is it that these people cannot build up the churches except with the profit they take from me? The churches are built up, and the war against the Muslims is raging with dirhams and without dirhams. Is the matter dependent on my dirhams that they take and spend in the churches or in the war against the Muslims? This is if we assume that they spent it in that. But this is an illusion and imagination. Satan dresses it up and says, “If you leave this, they will spend it in the churches, or else in the war against the Muslims.” Who said this?
In any case, between us and the people is the Book of Allah. And if we follow the Shari'ah, Allah will make for us a relief from every worry and an exit from every tightness. But if we go and use our minds to make analogies, and become like those who said, “Trade is just like usury,” or like the Shaytan who said, “I am better than him. You created me from fire and created him from clay,” then this is a mistake, a great mistake.
So the important thing is that this, my brothers, is a clear matter that does not require independent legal reasoning. If he is unable to pay and my debt is due, and he has nothing, do I not add something to it instead of giving him time? He says, “This does not contradict.” You have nothing now, but this thousand we will make a thousand and one hundred for a year. He says, “No, recite the verse after it.” There is no extension of the term for this poor person who has nothing to pay. It is obligatory for you to give him time until he is able to pay. Who told you to give him time until he is able to pay? Allah the Mighty and Majestic is the one who gave you the wealth and bestowed it upon you and permitted you to dispose of it. And He said to you, “If the one who is owed is poor, it is upon you to give him time.” You say, “No, I will not give him time. Let him be imprisoned, or let us add usury.” Where is the faith? Where is the worship? The true servant is the one who says to Allah, “For the command of Allah, we hear and obey.” As for the one who worships the dirham and the dinar, and has no concern except the dirham and the dinar, from whatever source he obtained it, this is a slave of the dinar and a slave of the dirham. And the Messenger (may the prayer and peace of Allah be upon him) cursed him with misery, destruction, and reversal.
Then comes the higher rank, which is better than giving time, and it is You say, “O so-and-so, you are unable to pay, and I have absolved you of this debt.” This is good, good for you. If it is good for you, do it. You came out of your mother’s womb with a thousand bags of dirhams, a thousand garments, a thousand head coverings, and a thousand sandals, right?
The student: No.

The Shaykh : Yes, correct. You did not come out of your mother’s womb with anything. You were naked, you had nothing, you had nothing. Who provided for you, prepared for you, and gave you the wealth? Allah the Mighty and Majestic said to you, “Do such and such.” Say, “Hear and obey.”
Then he concluded the verses by saying: Fear this day, the great day in which you will return to Allah, Mighty and Majestic, barefoot, naked, and uncircumcised. A man will flee from his brother, his mother, his father, his wife, and his children. Every person among them will have a matter on that Day that will occupy him. Fear this day, and the fear of this day and its evil and calamity is achieved by obeying Allah, Mighty and Majestic. I ask Allah to grant you and me mindfulness of Him, righteousness, and excellence. Indeed, He is capable of all things.

The questioner : ...

The Shaykh : That is, there is no harm. It has been mentioned previously that Allah said:

The questioner : ... bad wealth, spend it in ... the bad ...

The Shaykh : Always, always. And this is also a mistake. If I spend in bad wealth, in channels or other impure things, and I save my money, I save my money, and the dirham ... is bad. If I spend in bad things, all of this is due to limited understanding. If you spend it now, it means if ... for the toilet ... and you spend it from this bad wealth, you save yourself ten dirhams from the good money. So we have not done anything good, and the original taking is forbidden. The original taking is forbidden. It is not permissible. May Allah grant success.