When is the prostration for forgetfulness performed after the taslim and when before the taslim?
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The questioner : He says: When is the prostration for forgetfulness performed after the taslim and when before the taslim?
The Shaykh : This is actually an important question, and listeners should pay attention to what we will say, if Allah wills. If the prostration for forgetfulness is due to an addition in the prayer, it is performed after the taslim, whether the addition is verbal or physical. For example, a verbal addition occurs if a person says the taslim from his prayer before completing it, and then he is reminded and completes the prayer. In this case, he prostrates for forgetfulness after the taslim because he added a verbal addition, which is the taslim, in the middle of the prayer.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : So the prostration is after the taslim. The evidence for this is the hadith of Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him) when the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) prayed the midday or afternoon prayer in two rak'ahs and said the taslim, and then he was reminded and completed his prayer and said the taslim, and then he prostrated two prostrations after the taslim and said the taslim.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Likewise, if he adds a rak'ah to his prayer, such as praying the dawn prayer in three rak'ahs, or the sunset prayer in four, or the four-rak'ah prayer in five, he prostrates after the taslim. This is because the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) prayed the midday prayer with his Companions in five rak'ahs. When he said the taslim, they were asked, "Did you add to the prayer?" He said: They said, "You prayed five." So he (peace and blessings be upon him) turned his legs, faced the qiblah, prostrated two prostrations, and said the taslim.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : This is also a physical addition, and the prostration for it is after the taslim. You have learned the evidence for both, the evidence for the verbal and physical addition. As for the theoretical reasoning for this, the reasoning is that there should not be two additions in the prayer.
The questioner : Yes, yes.
The Shaykh : Namely, the verbal and physical addition that occurred due to forgetfulness, and the two prostrations for forgetfulness.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Therefore, it is wise for the two prostrations to be after the taslim so that two additions do not coincide in the prayer.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : And by this, we know that the rule is: if a person adds a verbal addition to his prayer that invalidates the prayer, such as the taslim, due to forgetfulness, or a physical addition that also invalidates the prayer, he must perform the prostration for forgetfulness, and its place is after the taslim. This is due to the evidential proof and the theoretical reasoning.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : However, if the two prostrations are due to a deficiency in the prayer, their place is before the taslim. For example, if a person forgets the first tashahhud and stands up, if he forgot the first tashahhud, because it is the middle tashahhud as they say...
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Then he stands up and does not return to it, but completes his prayer and prostrates before he says the taslim. This is because it is established from the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) that he stood up from two rak'ahs in the midday or afternoon prayer, and then he (peace and blessings be upon him) prostrated two prostrations before he said the taslim. Likewise, if he forgets to say "Subhan Rabbi al-'Azeem" in the ruku', or forgets to say "Subhan Rabbi al-A'la" in the sujud, or forgets to say the takbir in the transitions, in this case the prostration is before the taslim because it is due to a deficiency in the prayer. The evidence is what we mentioned regarding the Prophet's (peace and blessings be upon him) omission of the first tashahhud and his prostration before the taslim.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : As for its reasoning, since there is this deficiency in the prayer, it is appropriate to prostrate for forgetfulness before he says the taslim from it, so that the compensator exists before its completion. This is because this prostration compensates for the deficiency, so having the compensator before he says the taslim when there is a deficiency is more appropriate than having it after he says the taslim.
The questioner : You have done well...
The Shaykh : And there is also the issue of doubt: if a man doubts whether he prayed three or four rak'ahs in the four-rak'ah prayer, for example.
The questioner : Yes, yes.
The Shaykh : If the doubt is equal on both sides, with no preference for three or four, he makes it three, meaning he builds on the lesser number and completes it, and prostrates for forgetfulness before he says the taslim.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : However, if the doubt is weighted in his mind, such that it is more likely to him that it was three or that it was four, let him complete it based on what is more likely to him, but he prostrates for forgetfulness after the taslim. Yes.
The questioner : May Allah reward you.
The Shaykh : This is actually an important question, and listeners should pay attention to what we will say, if Allah wills. If the prostration for forgetfulness is due to an addition in the prayer, it is performed after the taslim, whether the addition is verbal or physical. For example, a verbal addition occurs if a person says the taslim from his prayer before completing it, and then he is reminded and completes the prayer. In this case, he prostrates for forgetfulness after the taslim because he added a verbal addition, which is the taslim, in the middle of the prayer.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : So the prostration is after the taslim. The evidence for this is the hadith of Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him) when the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) prayed the midday or afternoon prayer in two rak'ahs and said the taslim, and then he was reminded and completed his prayer and said the taslim, and then he prostrated two prostrations after the taslim and said the taslim.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Likewise, if he adds a rak'ah to his prayer, such as praying the dawn prayer in three rak'ahs, or the sunset prayer in four, or the four-rak'ah prayer in five, he prostrates after the taslim. This is because the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) prayed the midday prayer with his Companions in five rak'ahs. When he said the taslim, they were asked, "Did you add to the prayer?" He said:
And what is that
وما ذاكThe questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : This is also a physical addition, and the prostration for it is after the taslim. You have learned the evidence for both, the evidence for the verbal and physical addition. As for the theoretical reasoning for this, the reasoning is that there should not be two additions in the prayer.
The questioner : Yes, yes.
The Shaykh : Namely, the verbal and physical addition that occurred due to forgetfulness, and the two prostrations for forgetfulness.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Therefore, it is wise for the two prostrations to be after the taslim so that two additions do not coincide in the prayer.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : And by this, we know that the rule is: if a person adds a verbal addition to his prayer that invalidates the prayer, such as the taslim, due to forgetfulness, or a physical addition that also invalidates the prayer, he must perform the prostration for forgetfulness, and its place is after the taslim. This is due to the evidential proof and the theoretical reasoning.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : However, if the two prostrations are due to a deficiency in the prayer, their place is before the taslim. For example, if a person forgets the first tashahhud and stands up, if he forgot the first tashahhud, because it is the middle tashahhud as they say...
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : Then he stands up and does not return to it, but completes his prayer and prostrates before he says the taslim. This is because it is established from the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) that he stood up from two rak'ahs in the midday or afternoon prayer, and then he (peace and blessings be upon him) prostrated two prostrations before he said the taslim. Likewise, if he forgets to say "Subhan Rabbi al-'Azeem" in the ruku', or forgets to say "Subhan Rabbi al-A'la" in the sujud, or forgets to say the takbir in the transitions, in this case the prostration is before the taslim because it is due to a deficiency in the prayer. The evidence is what we mentioned regarding the Prophet's (peace and blessings be upon him) omission of the first tashahhud and his prostration before the taslim.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : As for its reasoning, since there is this deficiency in the prayer, it is appropriate to prostrate for forgetfulness before he says the taslim from it, so that the compensator exists before its completion. This is because this prostration compensates for the deficiency, so having the compensator before he says the taslim when there is a deficiency is more appropriate than having it after he says the taslim.
The questioner : You have done well...
The Shaykh : And there is also the issue of doubt: if a man doubts whether he prayed three or four rak'ahs in the four-rak'ah prayer, for example.
The questioner : Yes, yes.
The Shaykh : If the doubt is equal on both sides, with no preference for three or four, he makes it three, meaning he builds on the lesser number and completes it, and prostrates for forgetfulness before he says the taslim.
The questioner : Yes.
The Shaykh : However, if the doubt is weighted in his mind, such that it is more likely to him that it was three or that it was four, let him complete it based on what is more likely to him, but he prostrates for forgetfulness after the taslim. Yes.
The questioner : May Allah reward you.