What is your opinion of this statement: that Allah (Mighty and Majestic) rose above the Throne, meaning He ended up with it after He created the heavens and the earth?
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The questioner : May Allah reward you. This person says: There is a statement regarding the issue of rising above the Throne (istiwa') which says: That Allah (Mighty and Majestic) rose above the Throne, meaning He ended up with it after He created the heavens and the earth, and then He began creating what came after them. What is your opinion of this statement?
The Shaykh : Our view of this statement is that it is invalid, because Allah did not say "He rose to the Throne," but rather He said: And because the Throne existed before the heavens and the earth, as Allah the Exalted said: [Hud 11:7]. So there is no doubt, by the consensus of the Muslims, that the Throne existed before the heavens and the earth. The scholars differed regarding the Throne and the Pen, the Pen in which the divine decree was written: did the Throne exist before it, or did the Throne exist after it? There are two statements on this, which Ibn al-Qayyim indicated in his poem al-Nuniyyah, which is known as al-Kafiyyah al-Shafiyyah, and it is good in its subject of creed. He said:
"And people differ regarding the Pen with which *** the decree was written by the Judge
Whether it was before the Throne or after it *** There are two statements according to Abu al-'Ala' al-Hamdani
And the truth is that the Throne was before it *** For before the writing, it had pillars."
Yes. As for this new meaning mentioned by the questioner, "He rose to the Throne," I have not known anyone to say this. And if anyone says it, it is an invalid statement. Yes.
The Shaykh : Our view of this statement is that it is invalid, because Allah did not say "He rose to the Throne," but rather He said:
He settled upon the Throne
استوى على العرشAnd it is He who created the heavens and the earth in six days - and His Throne had been upon water
هو الذي خلق السماوات والأرض في ستة أيام وكان عرشه على الماء"And people differ regarding the Pen with which *** the decree was written by the Judge
Whether it was before the Throne or after it *** There are two statements according to Abu al-'Ala' al-Hamdani
And the truth is that the Throne was before it *** For before the writing, it had pillars."
Yes. As for this new meaning mentioned by the questioner, "He rose to the Throne," I have not known anyone to say this. And if anyone says it, it is an invalid statement. Yes.