Is it permissible to call the angels of the Throne Cherubim?
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The questioner : I say, O Shaykh, among the questions from your Saudi trip, you mentioned that you met one of the Azhar scholars, and he told you that there are angels called Cherubim. Meanwhile, I found that you denied this to him, yet I found it in the book *Mukhtasar al-'Ulu* by al-Dhahabi, and you did not comment on it on page 100.
The Shaykh : This is not a statement, may Allah reward you.
It is not well-known: But our Shaykh, you have an article in *Al-Muslimun* in the fifties regarding the hadith of the Cherubim and its denial, and so on.
The Shaykh : The important thing, my brother, is that the hadith is found in some books, but it is not authentic. As for my not commenting on it, that is another matter. But I was afraid that you would say I denied something that you had authenticated, in which case you would be retracting the denial in favor of authenticity. The hadith of the Cherubim is not authentic at all, especially since this Azhar scholar placed them above the Throne. Because you are recalling the discussion that took place, he attributed to the Wahhabis—whom we mean by this attribution, because we believe in Allah and His attributes—that they are anthropomorphists and that they place Allah in a location. This is among the misguideds who do not understand that Allah is not in a location, despite His rising above His Throne, Blessed and Exalted is He. So I wanted to clarify this to him through a sequence of questions. We asked him: Is a location something existent or non-existent? He said: It is something existent. I said to him: Is every existent thing preceded by non-existence? He said: Yes. We said: Is it limited or absolute, unlimited? He said: Limited. We said: Are we now in a location on earth? He said: Yes. Above the earth is the first heaven, a location, yes. Did we reach the seventh heaven, a location? Yes, a location. Well, above the Throne, above the seventh heaven, what is there? The Throne. I said to him: Is it a location? He said: Yes. And above the Throne, what is there? He surprised me with this myth: these Cherubim angels. I said to him: Where did you get this from? Cherubim angels? Is there a text in the Qur'an? He said: No. In a hadith? He said: No. I said to him: Well, where from? He said: This is how they taught us in the Noble Azhar. I said to him: How strange.
The questioner : Also, O Shaykh, I found it in Ibn Kathir's tafsir, in the tafsir of Surat Ghafir.
The Shaykh : It does not matter to them, my brother. Did you find it authenticated? It is not important. We find a lot of this in the abridged tafsir of Ibn Kathir by the Shaykh whom you were afflicted with, al-Sabuni. He takes hadiths from Ibn Kathir and puts them in his abridgment, and Ibn Kathir attributed them to so-and-so, and the attribution is placed below, meaning that the tracing is his and the hadith is authentic. Whereas Ibn Kathir may have narrated the hadith without knowing the chain of narration, so he would say, for example, "Abu Ya'la narrated it in the Musnad," and he would put it below. The point is, he surprised me with Cherubim angels above the Throne. I went through the hadith with him in sequence. He said: This is what they taught us in the Azhar. I said: If, O Shaykh, the Azhar decides, unfortunately, that a sound hadith does not establish a belief unless it is mass-transmitted, how do you believe in things for which there is not even one sound hadith? This is like what I said earlier: what does not come with you, come with it. Suppose there are Cherubim angels above the Throne, and after that, what is there? He said: Nothing. I said to him: Is there a location? He said: No. I said to him: Why do you accuse us of placing Allah in a location?[Taha 20:5] There is no location here. The location is created, and Allah is the Creator. And He was before He created anything, location and time, and so on. So may Allah reward you. The Cherubim have some reports, and you will find a lot in the book *Al-'Azamah* by Abu...The Shaykh : And now, contrary to custom, the women preceded us. Peace be upon you and Allah's mercy.
The questioner: May Allah reward you with good, O Shaykh.
Abu Layla : May Allah give you well-being, O our Shaykh.
The Shaykh : This is not a statement, may Allah reward you.
It is not well-known: But our Shaykh, you have an article in *Al-Muslimun* in the fifties regarding the hadith of the Cherubim and its denial, and so on.
The Shaykh : The important thing, my brother, is that the hadith is found in some books, but it is not authentic. As for my not commenting on it, that is another matter. But I was afraid that you would say I denied something that you had authenticated, in which case you would be retracting the denial in favor of authenticity. The hadith of the Cherubim is not authentic at all, especially since this Azhar scholar placed them above the Throne. Because you are recalling the discussion that took place, he attributed to the Wahhabis—whom we mean by this attribution, because we believe in Allah and His attributes—that they are anthropomorphists and that they place Allah in a location. This is among the misguideds who do not understand that Allah is not in a location, despite His rising above His Throne, Blessed and Exalted is He. So I wanted to clarify this to him through a sequence of questions. We asked him: Is a location something existent or non-existent? He said: It is something existent. I said to him: Is every existent thing preceded by non-existence? He said: Yes. We said: Is it limited or absolute, unlimited? He said: Limited. We said: Are we now in a location on earth? He said: Yes. Above the earth is the first heaven, a location, yes. Did we reach the seventh heaven, a location? Yes, a location. Well, above the Throne, above the seventh heaven, what is there? The Throne. I said to him: Is it a location? He said: Yes. And above the Throne, what is there? He surprised me with this myth: these Cherubim angels. I said to him: Where did you get this from? Cherubim angels? Is there a text in the Qur'an? He said: No. In a hadith? He said: No. I said to him: Well, where from? He said: This is how they taught us in the Noble Azhar. I said to him: How strange.
The questioner : Also, O Shaykh, I found it in Ibn Kathir's tafsir, in the tafsir of Surat Ghafir.
The Shaykh : It does not matter to them, my brother. Did you find it authenticated? It is not important. We find a lot of this in the abridged tafsir of Ibn Kathir by the Shaykh whom you were afflicted with, al-Sabuni. He takes hadiths from Ibn Kathir and puts them in his abridgment, and Ibn Kathir attributed them to so-and-so, and the attribution is placed below, meaning that the tracing is his and the hadith is authentic. Whereas Ibn Kathir may have narrated the hadith without knowing the chain of narration, so he would say, for example, "Abu Ya'la narrated it in the Musnad," and he would put it below. The point is, he surprised me with Cherubim angels above the Throne. I went through the hadith with him in sequence. He said: This is what they taught us in the Azhar. I said: If, O Shaykh, the Azhar decides, unfortunately, that a sound hadith does not establish a belief unless it is mass-transmitted, how do you believe in things for which there is not even one sound hadith? This is like what I said earlier: what does not come with you, come with it. Suppose there are Cherubim angels above the Throne, and after that, what is there? He said: Nothing. I said to him: Is there a location? He said: No. I said to him: Why do you accuse us of placing Allah in a location?
The Most Merciful [who is] above the Throne established.
الرحمن على العرش استوىThe questioner: May Allah reward you with good, O Shaykh.
Abu Layla : May Allah give you well-being, O our Shaykh.
Source
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The Arabic text is copied verbatim from the original source, without any edits.